Using recovery gear

[MiddleAgeSubie]

I guess what I wonder is how are exhaust jacks easy to use. I put it in the area where I would use a normal jack, leaving what I thought was enough room. But, it got into the wheel well. Then I put it a lot more towards the middle of the car, all in an attempt to simulate tire replacement. Now part of it got out and wanted to hug the door. Then I pushed it further under the vehicle, but now the further edge was not far from the exhaust and there was some plastic I was afraid would get crushed.

Then I positioned it here and there without trying to inflate it again. It gets either under things with protruding bolts (skid plates) or the almost inescapable exhaust, or under the plastic that is found elsewhere.

I imagine that in case of real trouble I will find a way to make it work, but "EASY" is the last adjective I would use to describe my failed attempts to make any use of it at home.

Now, I used air compressor, not exhaust gas, which slowed me down, but that is not what I am referring to as "not easy." Rather, I mean the positioning of the thing under the car.

Where exactly under the car do you put it if you want to replace a front or a rear tire or to get either the front or the rear unstuck? The exhaust is in the middle of everything and I have dual exhaust to boot.

 

[Ratbag]

Gidday MAS

Any decent bull bag (air jack) should come with top and bottom felt pads. If yours didn't, just cut some 1/4 inch felt to size.

Cutting something similar out of three ply would serve the same purpose.

With my CT up on mine, I could rock the trailer as hard as I liked from side to side, and it barely moved. It was as stable as that! Mine has a WLL of 4,000 Kgs, IIRC.

As for placement: middle under centre door pillar; under sump guard, under spare wheel well.

 

[MiddleAgeSubie]

Gidday MAS

Any decent bull bag (air jack) should come with top and bottom felt pads. If yours didn't, just cut some 1/4 inch felt to size.

Cutting something similar out of three ply would serve the same purpose.

With my CT up on mine, I could rock the trailer as hard as I liked from side to side, and it barely moved. It was as stable as that! Mine has a WLL of 4,000 Kgs, IIRC.

As for placement: middle under centre door pillar; under sump guard, under spare wheel well.

Unrelated question, Ratbag,

Does the 2003 Forester have a tow hook? Or does it rely on the tie down points? Just asking for a friend.

 

[NachaLuva]

Does the 2003 Forester have a tow hook? Or does it rely on the tie down points? Just asking for a friend.

Haha...its a bag of worms we have opened yes? :rotfl:

 

[Kevin]

Does the 2003 Forester have a tow hook? Or does it rely on the tie down points? Just asking for a friend.

Yes

 

[Ratbag]

Unrelated question, Ratbag,

Does the 2003 Forester have a tow hook? Or does it rely on the tie down points? Just asking for a friend.

Our MY10 has front and rear recovery points. There is an eyebolt in the spare wheel area that needs to be used in accordance with the OM ...

 

[Kevin]

The 2003 uses its tie-down points. They are quite strong enough.

 

[Ratbag]

The 2003 uses its tie-down points. They are quite strong enough.

I misread that as "2013" ... Such is my life ATM .

MAS, our 2006 also has tie down points front and rear, one each side, not special recovery points like the SH onwards. If a load distribution strap is used, they are more than adequate IMO, as Kevin has said.

 

[NachaLuva]

Remember they are tie down points & not recovery points. Our little Subies will bend or they can be ripped out if you are too "enthusiastic" when snatching. As RB said, always use a distribution strap...

 

[MiddleAgeSubie]

Thanks for the note on the 03 Foz!

Back to the EXHAUST JACK, I did another test today, just to make sure the item won't be so easily returned, as it is obviously used now, LOL, and the results are MIXED.

The jack did not work with my exhaust at all. Maybe because it can't with dual ones. That's fine. I would rather carry fewer parts and I do not care for a bag full of exhaust fumes, ugh.

First, I jacked up the front carefully placing the air jack with the center of it right under the jacking point. The front and mid skid plate successfully shared the distributed load. I would not dare jack more to the front though. SUCCESS. Worked as advertized.

Second, I jacked up the rear under the spare wheel well, as per Ratbag. MASSIVE FAIL. The wheel well CAVED IN. That was not visible on the outside but it seemed weird that the car suddenly stopped lifting. So, I aborted the test. When I opened the trunk I saw the cargo tray lifted an inch in the back. Pushing the wheel well back to form took all of two hands and a push. LOL. Still, Ratbag owes me a doppio espresso, 2xLOL. True, there was a slight incline and thus more weight in the rear than usual, but this was an empty car.

NOW, I am pretty much stuck with the jack, but at least I know how to use it up front. Under the middle of the car, so as to have the main frame rails get the weight along with the rocker panel, should do the trick, too. In the rear, however, the only way to go would be under the proper jacking point, which is the rear differential skid plate. Unfortunately, an exhaust tube is right there and will surely mess things up.

In sum, as of now I consider the air jack useful up front, maybe middle/side, and extreme emergency-only in the rear, being ready for either a bent exhaust tube or broken air bag, or worse--damaged drivetrain. I guess using it in the rear is in extremis only indeed!

An exhaust jack half the size of this one would be way better, I think. It would be much easier to position it properly under jacking points.

At least I am happy I paid for a cheap one that works. I considered the ARB one at double the price, but I am not into buying luxury products. Glad I did not (my main recovery setup is made of Bubba rope shackles and an ARB strap, but that is different).

 

[ateday]

I guess that the overall size of the air jack is "calculated" to spread the load when in use, as in keeping kgs/unit area at a reasonable level. Should be easy to guesstimate or perhaps they have a maximum working pressure marked on them.
Thus avoiding points of high pressure which would require a greater internal pressure.
Not having observed one in use for a looooong time I can`t remember how pliable the two opposing surfaces are. I would think that they are flexible enough to fold over and around whatever surfaces they are in contact with.
Must investigate further and purchase one to play with......one of these days.

 

[Ratbag]

Remember they are tie down points & not recovery points. Our little Subies will bend or they can be ripped out if you are too "enthusiastic" when snatching. As RB said, always use a distribution strap...

Pays to remember that the SG is a lot stronger all round than the SF.
Just from eye-balling it, the SH appears stronger again.

The 'rear' tie down points are forward of the rear wheels, so should be very hard to break ...

However, the bolt that holds the rear tow bar tongue in place is rated to at least 1,900 Kgs (50x50 mm - mine is, anyway, according to the compliance plate), and that is for a 'live' load.

 

[Ratbag]

Thanks for the note on the 03 Foz!

Back to the EXHAUST JACK, I did another test today, just to make sure the item won't be so easily returned, as it is obviously used now, LOL, and the results are MIXED.

The jack did not work with my exhaust at all. Maybe because it can't with dual ones. That's fine. I would rather carry fewer parts and I do not care for a bag full of exhaust fumes, ugh.

First, I jacked up the front carefully placing the air jack with the center of it right under the jacking point. The front and mid skid plate successfully shared the distributed load. I would not dare jack more to the front though. SUCCESS. Worked as advertized.

Second, I jacked up the rear under the spare wheel well, as per Ratbag. MASSIVE FAIL. The wheel well CAVED IN. That was not visible on the outside but it seemed weird that the car suddenly stopped lifting. So, I aborted the test. When I opened the trunk I saw the cargo tray lifted an inch in the back. Pushing the wheel well back to form took all of two hands and a push. LOL. Still, Ratbag owes me a doppio espresso, 2xLOL. True, there was a slight incline and thus more weight in the rear than usual, but this was an empty car.

NOW, I am pretty much stuck with the jack, but at least I know how to use it up front. Under the middle of the car, so as to have the main frame rails get the weight along with the rocker panel, should do the trick, too. In the rear, however, the only way to go would be under the proper jacking point, which is the rear differential skid plate. Unfortunately, an exhaust tube is right there and will surely mess things up.

In sum, as of now I consider the air jack useful up front, maybe middle/side, and extreme emergency-only in the rear, being ready for either a bent exhaust tube or broken air bag, or worse--damaged drivetrain. I guess using it in the rear is in extremis only indeed!

An exhaust jack half the size of this one would be way better, I think. It would be much easier to position it properly under jacking points.

At least I am happy I paid for a cheap one that works. I considered the ARB one at double the price, but I am not into buying luxury products. Glad I did not (my main recovery setup is made of Bubba rope shackles and an ARB strap, but that is different).

Sorry about that, MAS .
I am so used to cars with tow bars that I didn't even consider what would happen without one! I haven't owned a car without a rated tow bar since about 1971 ...

Glad your damage was as easy to fix as it was to cause.

The West Australian Police Force highly recommend bull bags, and highly discourage the use of wallaby jacks. I know why, from personal experience - all too easy to lose finger/s or a hand using high lift jacks (or other even more serious injuries ... ); i.e. life threatening injuries in a situation that is already potentially dangerous!

BTW, a bull bag doesn't have to be used under jacking points. They spread the load over a very large area, unlike any conventional jack. e.g.

Ateday's comments are spot on.

 

[jon_slider]

I jacked up the rear under the spare wheel well, as per Ratbag. MASSIVE FAIL. The wheel well CAVED IN.

thanks for the warning
I have a Bushranger Xjack rated for 4 tons. I have not tried the Xjack on my 2006 Subaru Outback Wagon. I was afraid to try it even before your post.

I used the Xjack once on a 5000 pound actual weight, VW Syncro whose rear axle weight was 2700 pounds actual (I weighed it at a truck stop).

We placed the Xjack under a massive load bearing custom skid plate below the middle of the van, near the back bumper, and lifted both rear wheels at the same time.

When it reached full extension, the Xjack collapsed to the side, dropping the Van. I do not have a photo. We tried this twice before my mechanic friend shook his head shouting, THAT IS NOT SAFE!

He then used the stock scissor jack on a couple of blocks of wood to lift One wheel, so he could change out a broken half shaft for me (wheel axle with two CV joints, same as a subaru.)

Here is a pic of another Syncro owner testing an XJack.. note how it caves in on the side when lifting even just ONE wheel. A syncro has a GVWR of 5500 pounds.

and some of the damage to the protective pad

I am not at all inclined to test the Xjack on my Subaru, and regret buying it. If anyone wants it for a significant savings, PM me.

I dont understand all the different models of Forrester mentioned, nor their various recovery points, I wish there were more pictures.

I would like some help sorting out my 2006 Subaru Outback Wagon recovery points and tie down points. And feedback on whether my shackles and snatch strap, from my Syncro, are appropriate for the Subaru.

Here is the front recovery point, with the bolt that comes in the spare tire tool kit. I have not tried removing that cover, any warnings on how to break it?.
The Shackle is a 5/8" with a WLL of 4.5T (I think that means 9000 pounds in USA)

the shackles

Here is a possible rear recovery point, does that look Kosher? The Shackle is 5/8" with a WLL of 3.25T

I have a 17,500 pound (8000 Kg) 2" wide by 30' long Snatch Strap, is this too strong for the Subaru?

The tront of the car also has two tie down points, but they sit above the bumper line, imo would not be suitable for recovery, even with a tree strap through both, because the pull direction would bring the straps up against the bumper, ripping plastic bits apart. Am I correct in these interpretations?

a video of a couple of friends, non subaru, showing a failure to recover when using a snatch strap as a tow line, with no running start

and here they are letting the snatch strap jerk the pull, by having the lead vehicle take a run at the pull while the strap is slack

pretty rough treatment, to both vehicles. I think a hand winch would be kinder and gentler
this is a 3 ton Wyeth with Amsteel Blue option:

and here is a Magnum Hand Winch I own… It could have self recovered the White Van in the video without need for a snatching vehicle.

 

[MiddleAgeSubie]

Whoa, what a nice post Jon!

I try not to get in need of recovery and my first 3,000 unpaved Subie miles have not required any (2,200 on the OB).

Here is what I have:

I use the same eye bolt. I purchased a second one from the dealer for about 20.
I have this as my main strap, same as yours?: [ame="https://www.amazon.com/ARB-ARB705US-2-3-Recovery-Strap/dp/B004P9DQLC/ref=sr_1_1?s=automotive&ie=UTF8&qid=1429072428&sr=1-1&keywords=Arb+STRAP"]Amazon.com: ARB ARB705 2-3/8" x 30' Recovery Strap - 17500 lbs Capacity: Automotive[/ame]

I have two of these as my shackles: [ame="https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00PEVGXRO?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=od_aui_detailpages01"]Bubba Rope 176745 GATORJAW SFT SHACKLE 7/16 by Bubba Rope: Amazon.com: Industrial & Scientific[/ame]

And this as light-duty strap: [ame="https://www.amazon.com/20-Tow-Strap-Recovery/dp/B00N4IDPZM/ref=pd_sim_sbs_auto_5?ie=UTF8&refRID=1GV9FEDS3GY5W4WYQYVK"]Amazon.com: 2", 20' Tow Strap with Reinforced Loops 10,000 LB Capacity: Automotive[/ame]


Now, Australia has a lot of regulations that the US does not have:
https://www.juststraps.com.au/pdf/Snatch%20Straps%20Industry%20Guidelines%20Final%20March%2008%20Amended%20pdf.pdf

However, reading that and then looking at what is available in the US can lead to despair. My ARB strap is the closest I got to balancing Aussie recommendations with stuff available in the US. Generally, what is sold here tends to vastly exceed what seems to be optimal. It is just one of all those small things that single Subaru out as NON off-road brand in the US.

I would most definitely NOT turn a hitch eye into a recovery point. Those strike me as very weak.

My air jack works great for the front of the vehicle and for the trailer and for the latter reason will be on board even on non-offroad trips. I am sure that in case of dire need I will find a way to use it in the back as well. I also carry a thick plank that can be used with the stock jack to replace a single rear tire.

Winching sounds like a great idea except that, again, we are talking about heavy, bulky equipment (if of good quality) that one has no plans to actually use (ok a few do, but very few).

Of course, I write everything from the point of view of a car with 4 occupants. Once the entire rear becomes cargo area, the sensible options increase exponentially.

 

[NachaLuva]

I have this as my main strap, same as yours?: Amazon.com: ARB ARB705 2-3/8" x 30' Recovery Strap - 17500 lbs Capacity: Automotive

https://www.amazon.com/ARB-ARB705US...UTF8&qid=1429072428&sr=1-1&keywords=Arb+STRAP

MAS, I recommend you don't use that recovery or snatch strap on your Subie. 17,500lbs or ~8T is too high for our lightweight Subies and won't have enough stretch. 5T 11000lbs is much more suitable, even if heavily laden.

https://www.amazon.com/ARB-ARB705US...UTF8&qid=1429072428&sr=1-1&keywords=Arb+STRAP

And this as light-duty strap: Amazon.com: 2", 20' Tow Strap with Reinforced Loops 10,000 LB Capacity: Automotive

Remember this is a tow strap & should never be used to recover a vehicle

 

[jon_slider]

@ MiddleAgeSubie, thanks for the kind words.
Your soft shackles seem like a very nice piece of kit. And your addition of a Tow Strap, besides a Snatch Strap, seems very practical. I really like your choice of gear, thanks for taking the time to include links.

I recommend you don't use that recovery or snatch strap on your Subie. 17,500lbs or ~8T is too high for our lightweight Subies and won't have enough stretch.

thanks for the warning

I would most definitely NOT turn a hitch eye into a recovery point. Those strike me as very weak.

I agree the Tow Hitch Receiver Shackle is a much better option. Now I get to go shopping

 

[NachaLuva]

jon_slider, I missed your earlier post. Have another look at the second recovery vid, you can see there's hardly any stretch in the strap, if at all. Thats why its looks so violent.
https://youtu.be/ikq7nJhgVRQ
This is why we need smaller snatch straps with our Subies of around 5T, 11000lbs maximum. The higher the SWL the less stretch at a lower weight.

That hitch receiver you've shown is welded, I'd get one of the billet steel ones, they usually also have an extra hole for mounting on its side, useful in angled recoveries.

Be very careful of using the screw in bolt, they're really only meant for gentle recoveries, not if you're stuck solid. Always dig out as much mud/sand from in front of the wheels as you can.

Another point everyone should remember is never do a recovery in reverse unless you have no choice, & then go easy. Reverse gear isn't very strong & you don't want to strip it out bush lol. Plus the front recovery points aren't very strong in our Subies

 

[jon_slider]

you can see there's hardly any stretch in the strap, if at all.
...
That hitch receiver you've shown is welded, I'd get one of the billet steel ones,
...
Be very careful of using the screw in bolt, they're really only meant for gentle recoveries
…
never do a recovery in reverse
…
the front recovery points aren't very strong in our Subies

thanks for all the input
sounds like my outback belongs on pavement

and yes, I do think that is actually a tow strap in the video, and Maxtrax might have been more effective...

 

[MiddleAgeSubie]

[/URL]

MAS, I recommend you don't use that recovery or snatch strap on your Subie. 17,500lbs or ~8T is too high for our lightweight Subies and won't have enough stretch. 5T 11000lbs is much more suitable, even if heavily laden.



Remember this is a tow strap & should never be used to recover a vehicle

As I said, 17,500lb is the lowest rated brand name actual recovery strap I could find here.

In addition, the weight of the vehicle is only one part of the equation:
https://www.pirate4x4.com/tech/billavista/Recovery/

I suppose that the eye of the eye bolt is the weakest link, hence my soft shackles.

As for hitches. Well...a hitch is usually rated for only 5,000 lb or less on a Subie. And how strong is the pin that holds the recovery insert in the hitch? That would be my chief concern with those recovery inserts.