Off topic gun talk

Accidents are an unfortunate by product of life. Kids get run over all the time in driveways because of accidents, does that mean we should get rid of cars too?

Good point. Education would be the answer.

It may escalate a situation too like you said, but more often than you think, it stops the escalation from going further & saves lives down the road.

All I know is in Oz we have very tough gun laws. There are still a lot of bad guys with guns, & shootings do occur, but the rate is pretty low. In New Orleans alone, there is on average 2 shooting fatalies per night! (recently saw a show on it). Compare that to Japan where shootings are almost non-existent.

Anyway, with the Olympics coming up, let enjoy the target shooting there lol. Everything from pistols to shotguns...and archery! :biggrin:
 
Ok. I am a new member and guess I will jump in here neck deep on this topic.
Each country and culture is different. There are many angles on this subject. I call it the coke bottle effect. It depends on how you look through it.
I agree with dirtyRu 100% but also understand all the Australian views. Ru and I are inside the box looking out and others are outside looking in.
My wife is from Sheffield England. When we met she never really seen a gun much less held one. She was scared sh""less of them. However in time she became curious. I never forced this issue on her. Finally one day she asked me to go target shooting. After a LONG safety session she got over her "conditioned fear" and quite enjoyed it.
When I visited England and met her family, I was able to step out of the box and look back in where I stood and listen to their views and opinons on this subject. It all boils down to cultural differences.
I support the 2nd amendment which allows us to bear arms. Unfortunately we have a minority of idiots here in the U.S. that do not have a clue about gun safety and misuses same. This over shadows the majority of responsible gun owners.
I currently have a Glock 22 40 cal. holstered and on my side right now as I type this. This gun is as part of me as some of you wear watches, carry brief cases, and what ever object your job requires you to have. I respect it and know its capabilities. I guess I will let the cat out of the bag on what I do for a living. I have been a Law Enforcement Officer for 23 years now. Before anyone shreds me, I treat everyone I encounter the same way I expect to be treated. I have seen the good, the bad, and the ugly. Have I had a gun pointed at me??? Yep!! Have I pointed back??? Hell Yes!!
I am sworn to protect and serve the community around me. We can debate this back and forth to no end. But simply put " Perception Is Reality ". What you think is right may not always be.
The outdoors is my outlet. To keep this in line with this site, my forester gets me there.
 
No one will be shredding you on this site! :iconwink:

I admire the people who put themselves in harms way to protect others.

The reality over here is that despite the tough gun laws, the crooks still have them. If we were having this conversation in the outback the farmers / ranchers would wonder what all the fuss is about!
 
No one will be shredding you on this site! :iconwink:

I admire the people who put themselves in harms way to protect others.
Ditto.

I too have got a the utmost respect for these men & women.

Regards
Mr Turbo
 
Thanks fellows.
Kevin, it would be the same over here if the government would pass strict gun laws.
The thugs, theives, psycos, and pill heads would take over.That is why it is such a hot political issue. Your average citizen would not stand a chance.
Google NRA Armed Citizen and you will see the flip side of the coin.
 
This happened just yesterday in Florida. The old man that saved the day had his CHL & one brave S.O.B!
There's no telling how many lives he saved then & then even down the road if the bad guys were to strike again.

[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wWoLGC-n4i4"]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wWoLGC-n4i4[/ame]
 
Unfortunately we have a minority of idiots here in the U.S. that do not have a clue about gun safety and misuses same. This over shadows the majority of responsible gun owners.

This doesn't change between cultures - that's pretty much the one common thread amongst all cultures! Unfortunately the behaviour of some law breaking individuals ruins what is a safe sport and passion for those that do follow the laws and regulations on firearm ownership and safe handling.

Over here police get antsy when you call a gun, well, a gun. The correct term is "firearm" - as stupid as it sounds I guess it also in some way shows the ones educated about firearms and their safety and the reckless who don't give a damn.

The reality over here is that despite the tough gun laws, the crooks still have them. If we were having this conversation in the outback the farmers / ranchers would wonder what all the fuss is about!

Totally on the mark there Kevin! The real issue is that while the innocent licensed and law abiding citizen does everything correct by the book, they're the one that ultimately gets punished through the actions of some unlicensed user usually with an un-registered firearm. Tougher laws come in and nothing has changed, other than the licensed law abiding citizen finds it harder to maintain their registrations and license. Crooks will still have their illegal firearms, no two ways about that.

And I'm also behind Kevin and mr turbo in what they said about putting yourself on the line for the good of the community you serve.

Regards

Bennie
 
I'm glad others have joined in, I didnt want to dominate the discussion.

Mark, kudos to you for putting your life on the line daily to protect others. Although you had me worried when you said your gun never left your side...I was thinking "uh oh...what do we have here" lol. Until I read you were a cop...big "phew" :rotfl:

With that video, you say he saved lives...I say he endangered them. What if they hadnt fleed but turned around & shot back. All those other people in the shop would have been in the firing line. So many times you hear you should just co-operate, give them your wallet & get them out with no-one being hurt.

Did you see the old guy shooting out the door? Too bad if you're walking along minding your your own business and cop a stray bullet fired from a crazy old man! If that person then died, guess who'd be going to prison!

You call him brave...I call him foolish. If that was me in there, I wouldnt be thanking him, I be telling him in no uncertain terms where he should put that gun!

Also, did you see the woman covering her ears? Why didnt she drop to the floor or run in the other direction? Are shootings so common that people only worry bout their hearing? :shrug:

A great vid to post RU. It really shows different cultures. Over here, even if guns were legal, that crazy old man would be arrested for reckless endangerment, over there he's claimed a hero
 
It's funny that you posted that vid up today dirtyRU (even though it happened about a week ago) as it actually made the news tonight over here in Australia :)

A great vid to post RU. It really shows different cultures.
It sure does :)

Regards
Mr Turbo
 
What a classic video, I'd love to be able to carry a hand gun, I've had a .22 Winchester rifle since I was 18 and was of the mentality of shoot whatever moved but I haven't put a bullet through it since 1981, we used to carry our guns everywhere and everyone had one and they did save a mate and I on a trip to Perth (I lived in the country north of Geraldton) my mate and I were cruising down in his GTR Torana at about midnight and this V8 Falcon came flying up behind us out in the middle of nowhere sitting about a meter off our bumper tooting & flashing it's lights with about 5 guys in it, we tried to outrun them but the Torry ran out of puff at about 110mph so I reached in the back seat and grabbed our rifles, we went slower and slower until we came to a stop as these idiots were up to no good, we both jumped out and fired off a couple of rounds in the air then pointed them at their windscreen...... you've never seen a car go so fast in reverse, my mate, the drivers father was the sergeant in charge of the Northampton police station so he put an alert out on the plates but we never heard any more.
 
This is a really good thread. Both cultural sides are learning from each other without shoving their ideals and views down each others throat. Kudos to all contributing to this discussion.
I'll give a little history about how I was raised and the area I grew up in. This may shed some light to others on my views.
I was born and raised in rural West Virginia. Before anyone thinks and asks, yes we have floors and running water in our houses..LOL. Children of my generation was taught accountability, respect of elders, and most important common sense. I was 6 years old when I got my first BB/pellet gun. Gun/firearm safety was literally engrained into my brain at this age. Most all of the community owned firearms. Why?? They were tools not weapons. My grandfather and Uncles put alot of food on the table for their families (wild game) , put down beef cattle and hogs for slaughter, protect the garden from raiding crows, recreational target practing with family and friends, and least important factor in my time, protection.
I graduated up to a 22 cal. rifle at the age of 7. At the age of 10 I got my 20 gauge Remington model 1100 semi-automatic and at 12 my mother bought me a Marlin 30/30 lever action rifle. I am sure some are rolling back on their heals right now. These firearms/guns gave me an outlet when I was young. I could not wait to hit the forest and fields to hunt rabbits, squirrels, ducks, turkeys, and deer. This again taught me repect of the animals I harvested, respect for the firearm, and respect of the welfare of others. My uncle once told me "ONCE YOU PULL THAT TRIGGER, YOU CAN NEVER TAKE IT BACK !!!" That one statement has stuck with me to this day.
Now to get to the other side of it.. My community and region was safe when I grew up. I would walk to town by myself at a young age. Everyone knew each other to various degrees and helped one another if needed. If you stepped out of line the community held you accountable!!! Also, remember what I said about most all families and community members had a gun or access to one. This made idiots think twice about committing crimes in my neck of the woods. The "Majority Ruled !!!".
Checks and Balances at its best.
Now the tide has changed. I think the root cause is the break down of the family unit. Stick the kid in front of the TV, Xbox, and computer. Look at the violence these kids are soaking up in their brain. Not only in rual areas but this goes for Metro areas and everything between. I have worked in both.
I try my best to fight this battle. I am involved with the youth in my community. I attempt to introduce them to the Great Outdoors and what it has to offer. I encourage and teach fishing, firearms safety, archery, hiking, and camping.
All the above stated kept me out of trouble and got me where I am at today. Attempt to make a difference everyone. The World needs it.
Guns/Firearms are not necessarily bad. Remember "The Majority Rules"!!
 
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CALEB AND I BLUESTONE.jpgA picture is worth a thousand words. These are all college age students that I have been involved with. Americans, Japanese, and other cultures that I spend time with. Everyone pictured has graduated college, volunteers time to communities, helps with environmental clean ups, and IS a productive citizen. They have all owned and shot firearms. Great bunch that I am proud of. You got to start somewhere. I like the saying "You can't eat an elephant in one setting".
 
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Very sad...at least 12 people have been killed by a 24yo gunman at a movie theatre. He used a tear gas canister, & was arrested with a rifle, handgun and knife, plus another gun was found in the cinema.

It was this kind of event (Port Arthur) that prompted the very tough gun laws in Oz, however in the US it occurs far too often...with regularity :(:shake:

Imagine the carnage if a citizen had pulled out his own gun in a dark cinema & started firing back, far more could have been killed in the shootout. You will say he may have been killed, saving lives...I just see bullets flying back & forth in a dark environment with many more victims :(
 
Very sad...at least 12 people have been killed by a 24yo gunman at a movie theatre. He used a tear gas canister, & was arrested with a rifle, handgun and knife, plus another gun was found in the cinema.
Yes, very sad indeed :cry:
My thoughts go out to those people & their families at this time :(

Regards
Mr Turbo
 
This is a horrible tragedy no doubt, but i'm not sure how you could say it would be worse if there was someone in the crowd able to defend themselves. That would have no doubtably stopped the random gunfire that took place (as it's a little diff when someone is shooting back), either taking out the gunman or promting him to take cover, letting others escape.

Stricter gun laws only keep the innocent even more defencless. The sh*theads that do stuff like this will get them no matter what. Laws never stop theives from stealing, why would it stop gunmen from killing?

I hope they hang that mother f***er or cut him up & let him bleed out. Just sickening when i heard about it first thing this morning when i got to work at 4am.
I hope none of of several members in the Denver area were personally affected by this tragedy as Aurora is right outside. Really makes my heart hurt for them :(
 
This is a horrible tragedy no doubt, but i'm not sure how you could say it would be worse if there was someone in the crowd able to defend themselves. That would have no doubtably stopped the random gunfire that took place (as it's a little diff when someone is shooting back), either taking out the gunman or promting him to take cover, letting others escape.

He MAY have taken out the gunman, but he is more likely to have missed in the dark with the teargas & all the confusion, this "hero" then may have killed others. Not only would these people now unnecessarily be dead, but the "hero" would have their deaths on his conscience for the rest of his life, plus be in jail!

Also, how bout the permanent lifelong injuries such as brain & spinal trauma. He would then be sued. So now the "hero" & his family are broke for the rest of their lives, guilt-ridden & in jail. How much worse can it get?

I think it is far better to have one shooter than 2 or 3 or more.

Stricter gun laws only keep the innocent even more defencless. The sh*theads that do stuff like this will get them no matter what. Laws never stop theives from stealing, why would it stop gunmen from killing?

I dont think this guy was some hardened criminal, just a young guy with severe issues that he took out on others. Exactly the kind of guy that strict gun laws would stop from getting guns, esp tear gas. I mean seriously...who needs teargas?! :shrug:


This certainly is very sad, but I would like to put things in perspective.

Consider planes with events over the last decade. Would you want passengers to be armed in case one passenger went crazy? This is the perfect example of strict gun control, not just laws but enforcement. I'm sure everyone will agree that NO weapons is the preferred position on a plane, with the only exception of the in flight marshal, who obviously is highly trained & screened.

Remember Columbine? That was a teenage student. No way would he get a gun with strict gun laws. It is so sad that wasnt an isolated incident: Virginia Tech; Red Lake Senior High School in Minnesota; Chardon, Ohio; All committed by students.


An article by Dr. Frank Ochberg sums it up well.
Dr. Frank Ochberg is Clinical Professor of Psychiatry at Michigan State University and former Associate Director of the National Institute of Mental Health.

"Access to guns
Access to guns is a significant factor in American school shootings. If kids could not and did not bring guns to school, we wouldn't have Columbine, Virginia Tech or Chardon, Ohio. There have been crimes with knives and bats and fists. But school shootings are gun crimes. Kids with guns kill kids at school.
I do not think America is an extremist nation, compared to other nations with bloody histories and despotic leaders. True, we have polarized political speech, and some of that speech is about access to guns. But the reason we have an American school shooting problem that exceeds other nations has to do with access to loaded weapons by kids who should not have that access.
I'm not offering a gun control solution. But any serious attempt to prevent school shooting will have to attack the problem by determining who should not be armed, and preventing dangerous boys from bringing guns to school."


The same could be said of all citizens, no matter what country they are in.
 
Natureluva...You've been here for quite a short time yet you've averaged over 5 posts per day sprouting your ******************** idea's to everyone, ....................

I for one am sick of reading your arguments to nearly every post, you're 44, haven't you worked out yet that you won't influence the way people think just because you think that way.
 
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