Bit of a problem with lift compliance

pbilz said:
Beachworm...

QCOP and QLD VSI L19 trump the NCOP for light vehicle lifts in QLD.

https://www.tmr.qld.gov.au/Safety/V...cle-modifications/Light-vehicle-modifications

Please Note: Not all parts of the NCOP have been accepted for use in Queensland, with variations applied for certain sections. For further information about these variations, please refer to the following Vehicle Standards Instructions:

VSI L19—Vehicle lifts under the Queensland Code of Practice — Vehicle Modifications
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This is true but the QCOP is more restrictive than the NCOP and the section on rims, tyres, suspension is referenced from the NCOP into the QCOP.

It's pretty clear really. As far as wheel and tyre size is concerned, Subarus are to be regarded the same as a normal car and not as a 4X4. Everyone with an overall diameter tyre more than 15mm bigger than the specified size for the model is defectable. This is nationally too, not just in QLD.

I am not convinced that it is a reasonable extrapolation being made by TMR to extend that principle to cover all modifications. I'll need to find someone at national level who can comment.
 
[MENTION=15642]Beachworm[/MENTION] you keep quoting passages that don't apply.

There is NO legal "softroader" category, it doesn't exist!!!!!!!!!
It's just something insecure 4wders made up to satisfy their massive egos





2x separate letters from TMR stating there is NO SOFTROADER SUBDIVISION!



The ADRs' definition of MC class. Note that there is NO SOFTROADER SUBDIVISION!

I just don't get why you're so determined to fail. You seek out every obscure passage to backup your belief that you can't lift a Forester within the law, and ignore everything else. If you actually wanted to find proof that you can legally lift a Forester with a 2" strut lift kit & 25mm tyre lift, you would find them. They're out there, I've even provided some for you
 
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Thanks for these letters. This is what I have asked you for before but not received. This is very helpful. Do I have permission to use this in my reply to TMR.

I understand your frustration but please don't lay the blame on me for what gets quoted. I am simply tabling the references given to me by TMR as justification for their decision requiring my Forester to have specific permission to install a strut top lift.
 
edit: not really adding anything useful so I deleted it.
 
Beachworm said:
Thanks for these letters. This is what I have asked you for before but not received. This is very helpful. Do I have permission to use this in my reply to TMR.
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Yes absolutely, feel free to use them
Sorry I didn't know you'd asked for them. I'd actually forgotten I had them, they were on my phone & not on the PC

I understand your frustration but please don't lay the blame on me for what gets quoted. I am simply tabling the references given to me by TMR as justification for their decision requiring my Forester to have specific permission to install a strut top lift.
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Yeah you're right, I was getting frustrated. I'm not very good at hiding my emotions lol

Yes I should be getting upset at TMR, they're the ones who have caused so much drama for so many people over the last 6-12 months & are doing it again with you
 
This is an issue that needs to be resolved once and for all. I sold my old OEM steel wheels to a guy the other day and he told me he needed them because he was pulled up by the police and they defected his Forester because his wheels and tyres were not permitted. He was running a combination that left him well within the 50mm limit.

It seems from Nachaluva's letters that TMR has either changed their position over the last 2 years or they have a problem with internal inconsistencies when it comes to application of the NCOP.


I need a document now that sets out an official position from a national perspective that gives a clear message that the section requiring AWD vehicles to be treated differently has been amended or deleted. If anyone has access to such a document, this would be very helpful.
 
Beachworm said:
or they have a problem with internal inconsistencies when it comes to application of the NCOP.
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Which wouldn't be surprising at all.
 
[MENTION=15623]Ben Up North[/MENTION] I updated the link to a later version "Compilation Date: 14/05/2016". Says the same thing though.
 
IMNSHO the words "unless otherwise approved" would refer, inter alia, to a vehicle compliance plate showing 'MC' as the vehicle classification.

This vehicle classification plate certifies that the vehicle manufacturer has already satisfied the legal requirements for this make/model in accordance with the relevant legislation.
 
Ben Up North said:
https://www.legislation.gov.au/Details/F2016C00487/Html/Text#_Toc450896116 may be userful, although 2005 (updated 2012), it is current and specifically defines the vehicle categories.
This in conjunction with the other current state documents regarding lifts & tyre sizes should be all that's required.
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Unfortunately for us, the National Code of Practice does state that All Wheel Drive Vehicles are not included in the group where a 50mm increase in tyre diameter is permitted. I have quoted this in previous posts so I won't do it again. The letter from Peter at TMR is useful for me to demonstrate inconsistencies in their approach to this clause but it doesn't eliminate the exclusion.

To exclude certain types of vehicles as this clause does is not creating a separate class of vehicle as far as the wording of the NCOP is concerned. The way TMR has applied this exclusion in their application of the Queensland Code effectively negates the MC classification of these vehicles and relegates them to the same modification requirements as those classified MA.

Unless we can locate an amendment to the National Code that repeals this exclusion and if the various state jurisdictions are intent on enforcing it, I fail to see how Subaru owners would have a legal leg to stand on when running oversize tyres. I can only hope that Peter is higher up the ladder than the bloke who responded to me and he decides to hold to his 2017 position.
 
Once you get (if at all) all this lift stuff sorted with Qld TMR, will you then have to go the same route with your Insurance Company to get Comprehensive Insurance and 3rd Party Insurance cover?
You would think that they too would have to re-write their policy coverage - wording etc. to reflect TMR's changes. 😕
 
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