HAS ANYONE USED OR CONSIDERED ADJUSTABLE SUSPENSION?

MiddleAgeSubie

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AZ
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2018 / 2008
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More great responses have come in!

Now, let me ask this, for the sake of a complete picture:

HAS ANYONE USED OR CONSIDERED ADJUSTABLE SUSPENSION?

I have seen air kits offered for Subarus. Theoretically, they should provide the best of both worlds plus a great ride. The cons seem equally obvious: huge initial cost + reliability concerns. Anything else that comes to mind?
 
Lets be clear though, comparing a relatively factory spec shock to a coil over isn't comparing apples to apples. It is not a direct price comparison.

Take any stock vehicle and ask yourself how to improve it's offroad capabilities. You'd look at a few key things first I reckon, clearances and traction (traction includes suspension and travel). If not first, they're givens. Now in a real suspension discussion you wouldn't be talking about a spacer on your shocks or a stock length but heavy-duty spring, both of which limit your travel. It'd be a purpose built shock/spring combo that gives the desired ride height, load carrying capacity, travel/articulation and just generally keeping your tyres touching the ground where you want them.

Coil over = you get adjustable height, rebound and compression. Extra travel in both compression and droop. Elimination of the strut top blocks. Extra tyre and shock tower clearance (narrower spring and perch). Spec'd to purpose/use spring rates, and being a standard coil over spring diameter you have pretty much limitless off the shelf spring choices too (lengths, rates etc etc). More robust and able to handle abuse. Ability to fully service/rebuild the coil overs as well as potentially upgrade internal valving, fluid, seals and bushes. Less parts and components than an air bag system for about the same cost, probably less.

To my mind struts tops/spacers and raised springs are a pathetic compensation for a lack of off the shelf suspension solutions. We have a choice of less clearance, or less travel.

Now I'm not to have a go at anyone for discussing this stuff or say it has no value, because it does. And for some people a spacer and a HD spring might be the ideal solution, I have strut top spacers and stock KYBs too. I do applaud jf1sf5 for going against the grain and finding a true suspension solution. I find it sad and frustrating that on an off-roading forum 99% of our suspension discussions are limited to brand, stock or HD spring and what strut spacer height. It's one area where I think modifying a Subaru for off-road really is a bit of a joke compared to the "real" 4WDs.
 
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Yeah, where's the options from OME, Ironman, Rancho, etc.
 
Quite simply, most people who buy any Subaru buy it for the company's well deserved reputation for build quality, reliability and primary and secondary safety, for a price that doesn't require one to sell Granny into the sex slave trade :iconwink: :biggrin: :rotfl:.

Compare the price with any comparable vehicle for basic qualities (e.g. a similar Honda), and the Subie is usually cheaper and better in almost every respect.
Getting parts for a Honda is very reminiscent of buying parts for my BMC cars back in the 1960s and 1970s ... Take one's model and year, engine number, chassis number and pot luck that you get a part that fits!

What I am saying is really self-evident - most Subarus never go off the bitumen - so the market for 'real' off road bits is very small. People like us.
 
jf1sf5 said:
Not that much…2'450.- USD :iconwink:
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Ok, so is that all inclusive before labor or does it exclude a bunch of other necessary parts?

Incidentally, I looked over the subaXtreme bullbars. I do not care for those looks, but the actual bumper replacement would be something I would love to do at some point. But the price is equally ridiculous.

This has become a really informative thread.

Obviously, there are big differences between markets. In the U.S. Wranglers maintain their value extremely well, but they are also affordable new. The aftermarket support is phenomenal. Used FJ Cruisers can also be found if one prefers to bet on Toyota reliability. Thus the appeal of heavily modifying a Subaru wanes quickly.

Still, coil overs, some of you say...;)
 
Coilovers are good enough for a gravel rally car
you just have to have appropriate lengths and spring rates.

My Liberty wagon has 5/6kg STi springs in it with matching bilsteins currently and they are pretty much spot on for a balance of towing without sagging, handling on road, but still sensible on gravel/ rough roads.
the stock springs were 3/4kg and just too soft for the mass of the car.

Somthing similar to a Tein Super-wagon would probably be quite suitable, Rates for an SG forester are 5/5kg
SF are 4/3kg
 
MiddleAgeSubie said:
Ok, so is that all inclusive before labor or does it exclude a bunch of other necessary parts?
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Its an all inclusive price with adjustable top mounts. If you use the OEM top mounts, you save about 400.- USD
 
Robbks said:
Coilovers are good enough for a gravel rally car
you just have to have appropriate lengths and spring rates.

My Liberty wagon has 5/6kg STi springs in it with matching bilsteins currently and they are pretty much spot on for a balance of towing without sagging, handling on road, but still sensible on gravel/ rough roads.
the stock springs were 3/4kg and just too soft for the mass of the car.

Somthing similar to a Tein Super-wagon would probably be quite suitable, Rates for an SG forester are 5/5kg
SF are 4/3kg
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How do you calculate the spring rates ?

I know that they can be calculated in N/mm or kg/cm or lbsf/in….but I don't know your way of calculating.
 
jf1sf5 said:
Its an all inclusive price with adjustable top mounts. If you use the OEM top mounts, you save about 400.- USD
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Pardon my ignorance, but how do you adjust height? And how does raised height play with alignment? I guess it does not matter if going up on trail only.
 
The height can be adjusted by turning clockwise or anti-clockwise the spring seats.

I did the alignment with a certain height (2" lift from OEM). If I want to drive in a higher car all the time, I have to do a new alignment, but if its only for a day or a week, I leave the alignment as is even with 1"-1"1/2 more lift and go back to "standard" after the "hard" 4x4 session has ended.
 
That sounds great, actually. So, I guess it does not take long to do that?

Of course, HotBits does not seem to offer anything for an OB, but this sounds like the closest setup to what I would like to eventually have.
 
jf1sf5 said:
How do you calculate the spring rates ?

I know that they can be calculated in N/mm or kg/cm or lbsf/in….but I don't know your way of calculating.
Click to expand...

kg/mm or kgf/mm
1kg/mm = 10N/mm

so essentially the spring needs you to put on 5kg to compress it 1mm
50kg extra will drop it 10mm
 
Venom, While it would be awesome having adjustable coilovers, I think having a better driveline esp with a front LSD & locking centre makes up for lack of articulation. Of course, it would be nice having both lol :lildevil:

jf1sf5 said:
Not that much…2'450.- USD :iconwink:
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Ouch! :eek:

Most people on here prob couldnt afford that when a complete set of new raised Kings & KYB struts is ~$800. But good on you for doing it, a lot of people are very jelly lol :monkeydance:

Ratbag said:
most Subarus never go off the bitumen - so the market for 'real' off road bits is very small. People like us.
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Have to disagree with that, the majority of Subaru owners buy Foresters, Outbacks & XVs for a combination of safety, reliability & gravel road use. That has always been Subaru's strength going back to Brumbies, L series, MYs, etc.

Of course, Liberties esp GTs & WRXs are almost exclusively used onroad :iconwink:
 
Basically, the coil overs seem only available for some models. Apparently, those that would fit mine are meant for lowering, making price a moot point for me.
 
NachaLuva said:
Venom, While it would be awesome having adjustable coilovers, I think having a better driveline esp with a front LSD & locking centre makes up for lack of articulation. Of course, it would be nice having both lol :lildevil:
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It compensates to an extent, yes. It does and never will fully compensate for it. It does not substitute good suspension. Jump on a 4WD forum and tell people front and rear lockers pretty much negates the need for good suspension. Yes you could. Yes it is better than completely stock. No, the most gold plated driveline does and nevery will substitute good suspension. To talk about it like they are mutually interchangeable is very a very narrow perspective. It's just as narrow to try to compare them, just as you wouldn't necessarilly compare a set of lockers to good suspension. They are very much mutually beneficial and necessary modifications.

A fair price comparison on LSDs vs. custom coil overs would be to compare brand new LSD units, which start around $1100 each. $1500 for a new Subaru torsen unit. I paid pretty much exactly 2,500 for my front and rear units, another $1,000 for the centre DCCD and controller. Plus another $1,000 or so for the gearbox to be built, 1.59 L/R etc. It is, all things said and done.. something in the region of a $3,500 driveline (probably more). Yeah less if you DIY and buy second hand. Probably more than what I paid if you don't do any DIY. My point? $2,500 is not ridiculous. You are actually getting something for that extra money.

For people interested in less extreme modifications some custom coil overs in fact make more sense. No strut blocks. No driveline modifcations. You could in fact daily drive at stock height. Very simple, very effective. A **** load better than stock shocks, springs and a spacer.

MiddleAgeSubie said:
Basically, the coil overs seem only available for some models. Apparently, those that would fit mine are meant for lowering, making price a moot point for me.
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Dude, yes off the shelf are virtually all tarmac orientated and for lowering. Hotbits is probably the only reasonable place you will get a custom set made. They have to be custom. You will not get an off the shelf solution unless it is rally suspension, which is expensive and unsuitable.

Coil overs are not "lowering" only. It is just a term for a type of strut. Coil overs are used in rally, dakar, hard core off-roading etc.
 
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Oh, ok, they showed various Subaru models, but not OB.

All things considered, then, coil overs, custom or otherwise, sound like the best solution for eventually getting what I really wanted: factory adjustable suspension option.

How well do these things hold over time?
 
They should last the time as any OEM suspension as long as they are not thrashed, though the hotbits are rebuild able so technically they should last forever.
I would ask them how they hold up too with salt etc, depending where you drive.
 
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