Cracked Sump Guard

Rally

Rally

Forum Member
Joined
Jul 11, 2008
Messages
3,928
Location
Sydney
Car Year
1999
Car Model
WRX
Transmission
6 Speed
I dropped the sump guard off this morning. In addition to the 2 cracks on the edge, they pointed out another 2 cracks- one in each of the structural ribs that run front to back. I left it with them- they rang to say they have welded it up and I can collect it on my way home. While they have done the right thing, and I have no complaints against them, I must admit to being disappointed. There is no way this sump guard has been thrashed- unlike the one on my Falcon. Yes, it has copped a few hits but I was told on the phone the thing should not crack- and they could not explain the cracks on the sides at all. The sump guard on the Falcon copped years of abuse without a crack- although I did have to knock it back into shape a couple of times. Big deal.

So while I will re-install it on the car, I might go and visit a bloke near my work who makes roll cages and sump guards for rally cars. I really should have gone to him first.
 
That is disappointing to hear :shake:

You'll have to let us how you go after talking to that person near your work :iconwink:
Depending on how that goes, I could be quite interested myself :)

Regards
Mr Turbo
 
thunder039 said:
i realy want/need a sump guard but at the moment it seem a custom one backyard job is the way to go, am i right?
Click to expand...

Yes and no. My custom one did sweet f*** all when the front of the car landed on it and smashed the sump of my engine in :eek: :censored:

My Subaxtreme one has a few small cracks in it but the car car landed on it a few times and its taken a few good hits. I would rather this than damage to the engine. Plus you don't want 4-5mm thick steel because if you take a good hit rather than the guard absorbing the the impact the car will absorb it and most likely damage something. This could be a more severe outcome.

My 2 cents worth though.
 
thanks for the input, just trying to get a few price on a sump gaurd if i get one made (cant do it myself because im useless with a welder) how many mm think steel would i be looking at?
after seeing this thread with the cracking makes me cautious on a subextreme sump gaurd
 
Mine is an old rally car guard, goes from up near the bumper to the back of the box, at a guess I'd say it was 6-7mm alloy, it's taken more hits than a Thai ladyboy and only ever received scrapes and dents that I had to beat out with a large hammer but never a sign of any cracking.

CIMG4013.jpg
 
Custom one has the potential to be a lot better as long as the right materials are chosen and the design is right.
 
Thanks for the update Rally.

I'm just trying to work out why these damn things are cracking so easy?!

Touch wood over here, but I don't have confidence in it anymore (I have a SubaXtreme one too). They make other quality products but their sump guards don't seem to be holding up. I wonder if the Forester guard is substantially different to the Outback?
 
No, the same sump guards with only minor variations are used right up till the end of the 07's apparently. I'll take some photos- you can come to your own conclusions
 
Gidday Rally

Rally said:
No, the same sump guards with only minor variations are used right up till the end of the 07's apparently. I'll take some photos- you can come to your own conclusions
Click to expand...

Like others, I am concerned that these are not up to snuff.

As you know, I have always had misgivings about cast alloy sump guards.

I look forward to your continued thoughts and investigations about both the Subaxtreme and possible alternatives.
 
Here are the photos:


SumpGuardRepairsApril2012008.jpg



SumpGuardRepairsApril2012001.jpg



SumpGuardRepairsApril2012002.jpg



SumpGuardRepairsApril2012003.jpg



SumpGuardRepairsApril2012004.jpg



SumpGuardRepairsApril2012005.jpg



SumpGuardRepairsApril2012006.jpg



SumpGuardRepairsApril2012007.jpg
 
Shiv said:
Thanks for the update Rally.

I'm just trying to work out why these damn things are cracking so easy?!

Touch wood over here, but I don't have confidence in it anymore (I have a SubaXtreme one too). They make other quality products but their sump guards don't seem to be holding up. I wonder if the Forester guard is substantially different to the Outback?
Click to expand...

Exactly the same, the outback one just has an extender plate which bolts on so it reaches the rear mounting points.

Unless people are doing hard stuff and throughing their Subies around (Mr T, Kevin, Stilson, myself etc..) a Subaxtreme one should be sufficient protection. The majority of you don't want to give your subies a hard time and thats fair enough.
I know I had my Foz slip off a muddy surface into a rut and it landed on the sumpguard causing it to crack, only very very small cracks though but I think theres 4 or 5 of them. I still feel like I have adequate protection and if the whole thing shatters then I will just get another one(if not repairable). Again after having to pay $~700 to get my engine sump repaired after it being smashed in the first time I see the price of these worth the money in comparison.
Note: They can also be welded up if need be

On another note most of you guys are concerned about insurance and with anything other than a Subaxtreme one, stock one (useless if you even take your car on a gravel road) or nothing are the only options you have for airbag compliancy.

Taza
 
G'day again Rally

The welds should be stronger than the original casting. IF they were done competently. Look a bit too 'flowed' to me ...

One look at these pics tells me that this is a basic design problem with this sump guard.

The ventilation slots are too close to the edges where the cracks have occurred IMVHO. They should be at least 3/4" shorter on the outer ends.

The longitudinal reinforcing ribs are not thick enough in cross-section, nor are they sufficiently wide at the base to provide the strength they are there to provide.
IMO, there should be at least three of these reinforcing ribs, and they should be more the shape of the crosswise reinforcing ribs.

Also IMO, there should be a further cross rib at the rear/centre of the sloping front section of the guard. This would allow for some ventilation holes along the front top edge of the guard in the centre just below where it is attached to the car frame.

The guard should also be thicker at the longitudinal edges. Instead of the "turn up" design, the edges should be like the cross section of the cross reinforcing bars; i.e. shaped like a quarter moulding.
If this were the case, it might make up for what appears to me to be an inherently weak design.
 
Gidday Taza

taza said:
Exactly the same, the outback one just has an extender plate which bolts on so it reaches the rear mounting points.

Unless people are doing hard stuff and throughing their Subies around (Mr T, Kevin, Stilson, myself etc..) a Subaxtreme one should be sufficient protection. The majority of you don't want to give your subies a hard time and thats fair enough.
Click to expand...

I sure don't want to wreck mine. However, that translates into my seeking the best way through or around an obstacle; not just jumping in, feet first ...

I know I had my Foz slip off a muddy surface into a rut and it landed on the sumpguard causing it to crack, only very very small cracks though but I think theres 4 or 5 of them. I still feel like I have adequate protection and if the whole thing shatters then I will just get another one(if not repairable). Again after having to pay $~700 to get my engine sump repaired after it being smashed in the first time I see the price of these worth the money in comparison.
Note: They can also be welded up if need be
Click to expand...

I don't disagree with any of this. However, it does help if the product is as well designed as it can be either ...


On another note most of you guys are concerned about insurance and with anything other than a Subaxtreme one, stock one (useless if you even take your car on a gravel road)
Click to expand...

I keep seeing this said here. I have a different view of the toughness of the "plastic" OEM guard.
During the Bunyip SP trip, I went straight down the ruts for around ten metres on my belly. Not even the "plastic" front, front wheel mud flaps got damaged. Neither did the "useless" "plastic" OEM guard. This gave me considerably more respect for this much maligned bit of kit.

Considering that if I had been in my old Landcruiser, I would probably have ripped out both diffs, front & rear springs, and possibly the drive shafts and transfer case ... I now have quite a lot more respect for the toughness and flexibility of the OEM "plastic" guard.

or nothing are the only options you have for airbag compliancy.

Taza
Click to expand...

True enough.

Maybe some of the suggestions I have made upthread could be useful to them in looking again at their basic design.
 
Ratbag said:
I keep seeing this said here. I have a different view of the toughness of the "plastic" OEM guard.
During the Bunyip SP trip, I went straight down the ruts for around ten metres on my belly. Not even the "plastic" front, front wheel mud flaps got damaged. Neither did the "useless" "plastic" OEM guard. This gave me considerably more respect for this much maligned bit of kit.

Considering that if I had been in my old Landcruiser, I would probably have ripped out both diffs, front & rear springs, and possibly the drive shafts and transfer case ... I now have quite a lot more respect for the toughness and flexibility of the OEM "plastic" guard.
Click to expand...

I think the OEM guard gains its negative reputation more for beach driving than anything else.

Mine never gave me any problems going off-road. But I hear that when taken on the beach, they act like a shovel, fill up with sand and inevitably rip off.
 
Gidday Shiv

Shiv said:
I think the OEM guard gains its negative reputation more for beach driving than anything else.

Mine never gave me any problems going off-road. But I hear that when taken on the beach, they act like a shovel, fill up with sand and inevitably rip off.
Click to expand...

I can understand that.

The leading edge of its 'lip' where it tucks behind the lower edge of the front bumper is too short.

After Bunyip, the leading edge of my plastic guard had pulled back and was underneath that bumper edge (sort of pouting ... ). A virtual guarantee that any semi-liquid like sand will cause it severe problems.

Even a couple of rivets (pretty gross, I know ... ) that merely secured their relationship to each other would help immeasurably IMHO. Maybe just riveting on a longer extension onto the guard would help a lot (maybe as little as an inch?).
 
The factory one is a splash guard. Anything extra is just a bonus. The issue I have is that while thee are scrape marks on the guard, the guard has not been given an unduly hard life. Yes, it did protect the sump, so yes it did do it's job. But what if after one or two applications of your brakes you had to go and buy brand new discs and calipers. Yes, they stopped the car but I really need them again in a few hundred metres
 
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