Damaged Tyre

[NachaLuva]

A friends tyre was damaged as she went through a drivethru :

Its a Goodyear Excellence 235/50/17... $285!

We went back there to try & get them to pay for a new tyre & wheel alignment, only to be told as she damaged it on the curb which borders the car park & the start of the drivethru, that its council property therefore their responsibility

So off we went to the council & made an incident report & were told they would get in touch with us soon.

What do you think our chances are of getting money from either?

 

[taza]

Pretty low to be honest. Thats not good, ive never seen one go like that before. ONly seen basket balls do that when you through them at the ground enough. haha

Thats pretty darn expensive for a road tyre thats not a performance one. Let us know what happens mate.

Taza

 

[NachaLuva]

Thats pretty darn expensive for a road tyre thats not a performance one.

She's had 2 tyres replaced before as aprt of an insurance claim...The dealer charged I think $340 ea! Thats what you get for OEM tyres... ripped off!!!

Just saw some VERY fine hairline fractures on the rim...looks like the rim needs to replaced now. Mega bucks for that from the dealer

The offending curb (note the black marks on the end from MANY cars hitting it...I wonder how many others have damage!):

 

[Rally]

I see it as more of a fault with the tyre. I have very little faith in Goodyear tyres. There are some kerbs that are very stupid in their design- one at my local shopping centre is quite nasty- and while I have not hit it I'd be surprised it it had not claimed a few victims. But in other instances it is often a case of driver error. They at least paint it white to make it easier to see- maybe other colours should be trialed?

 

[mr turbo]

What do you think our chances are of getting money from either?

To be honest, between buckley's & none, but I hope I'm wrong.

I see it as more of a fault with the tyre.

I'm of the same feeling as Rally
It looks like the tyre has bulged from a defect in the way it was manufactured, however I'm no expert & could be wrong

Regards
Mr Turbo

 

[Venom]

No offense but i think its pretty outrageous to suggest its a tyre fault. Tyres don't bulge like that from the factory. What are the odds of a tyre fault occuring at the same precise time and place that the wheel has impacted a curb? It doesn't. It happens when you hit curbs too fast and it would be the same for any brand. I've seen it many times, in fact i burst a tyre on a curb when a truck nearly ran me off the road. It went flat instantly. It's a particular way the curb pinches the sidewall. Just think how much that tyre must have deformed for it to compress far enough to mark the rim aswell, you can even see the gap in the rim marks where the rubber was pinched all the way against the wheel. Tyres just aren't designed for that kind of sidewall impact because they all have a degree of flex in the sidewall to absorb energy from the road.

 

[NachaLuva]

When we went to the tyre place. the guy said it was "impact damage". The cords in the side wall get broken and the side wall bulges out! Its non repairable, bit annoying on a tyre only a few months old

 

[mr turbo]

It looks like the tyre has bulged from a defect in the way it was manufactured, however I'm no expert & could be wrong

No offense but i think its pretty outrageous to suggest its a tyre fault. Tyres don't bulge like that from the factory.

No offense taken.
It was just my opinion

It happens when you hit curbs too fast and it would be the same for any brand. I've seen it many times, in fact i burst a tyre on a curb when a truck nearly ran me off the road. It went flat instantly. It's a particular way the curb pinches the sidewall.

When we went to the tyre place. the guy said it was "impact damage". The cords in the side wall get broken and the side wall bulges out!

I have to admit that I have hit a few gutters/curbs in my time sometimes fast & sometimes slow.
I did punch a hole in the sidewall once & scratched a few wheels/alloys etc, but I've never had a tyre bulge personally.
Maybe I've just been lucky I suppose

Regards
Mr Turbo

 

[d_generate]

Seriously........Time to take responsibility for her own actions, if she had taken a bit more care it never would have happened, same as the thousands and thousands of other people who made it through with their wheels and tyres unscathed.... and for those that have hit it before I'm sure they didn't run into the shop blaming them for putting a bloody great curb that is designed to guide you in the way.

Personally I hope the shire makes her get out there and paint it white again.

 

[Rally]

Agreed.

Tyres can and do fail like that. I once drove 60 km in the outback with a tyre that had a bulge in the tread and it was tyre failure. I have also had 2 tyres on a company vehicle not only bulge out, but the steel belts disintegrated, and in the process puncture the tyre. When you consider how many times we drive on dirt tracks and hit all manner of rocks at weird angles and nothing happens, it points strongly at rubbish tyres. Then when you read it was a Goodyear tyre it all adds up. What brand of tyre was on all of those Ford Explorers in the US that caused such a fuss?

Seriously........Time to take responsibility for her own actions, if she had taken a bit more care it never would have happened, same as the thousands and thousands of other people who made it through with their wheels and tyres unscathed.... and for those that have hit it before I'm sure they didn't run into the shop blaming them for putting a bloody great curb that is designed to guide you in the way.

Personally I hope the shire makes her get out there and paint it white again.

 

[NachaLuva]

Seriously........Time to take responsibility for her own actions, if she had taken a bit more care it never would have happened, same as the thousands and thousands of other people who made it through with their wheels and tyres unscathed.... and for those that have hit it before I'm sure they didn't run into the shop blaming them for putting a bloody great curb that is designed to guide you in the way.

I understand what you're saying & I agree that people need to take responsibility for their actions if THEY stuffed up but in this case the curb is badly designed. It juts out way too far in a very narrow drivethru. It doesnt guide you properly. I have never seen a drivethru that makes it almost impossible to drive through without at least some rubbing. If you look at the curb, many many people have hit it with their tyres. Also look further up, you will see many deep gashes taken out of the concrete by car underbodies. Sam wasnt careless or going fast, quite the opposite.

When the Quantas plane dived out of the sky & almost crashed, those passengers were compensated. It was the fault of poor computer design. This is a case of poor curb design. Poor design & poor maintenance (potholes) are not the fault of the driver!

Personally I hope the shire makes her get out there and paint it white again.

Dude...seriously, come on!

What if your driving along in a car park at a cautious speed, being alert etc, & some idiots trolley goes out of control & hits your car, smashing a headlight & denting panels...I bet any money you'd be after Blood! Wanting your repairs to be paid for. Well, by your reasoning, its YOUR fault for being there, you should have been going even slower & in fact now YOU OWE the supermarket a new trolley!!!

 

[taza]

Comeon guys lets not argue or fight, look at both sides.

What if your driving along in a car park at a cautious speed, being alert etc, & some idiots trolley goes out of control & hits your car, smashing a headlight & denting panels...I bet any money you'd be after Blood! Wanting your repairs to be paid for. Well, by your reasoning, its YOUR fault for being there, you should have been going even slower & in fact now YOU OWE the supermarket a new trolley!!!

If that were the case 'hypothetically' ; I would be after bloody. Grab an assorted tool from under the drivers seat, possibly standley knife and go after them. lol

I wouldn't be worried about fixing my car, but it depends on the situation.

If someone purposely damaged it, I would want bloody and money but thats me.


Im sure we all wouldn't buy certain tyres for certain reasons. I know I wouldn't get another Dunlop tyre again.

 

[El_Freddo]

But in other instances it is often a case of driver error. They at least paint it white to make it easier to see- maybe other colours should be trialed?

I don't think colours are going to make a difference. We're talking about simple driver error here - you can't tell me their focus was on the curbs or the drive through dimensions, they were thinking about what they were going to order. And if they were really smart they would have a) parked the car and walked in or b) supported the local sandwich bar for a healthy alternative.

I understand what you're saying & I agree that people need to take responsibility for their actions if THEY stuffed up but in this case the curb is badly designed. It juts out way too far in a very narrow drivethru. It doesnt guide you properly. I have never seen a drivethru that makes it almost impossible to drive through without at least some rubbing.

This is simple passing of the blame. If this drive through is build with similar features of other drive throughs you would think that people would learn to be careful when using them.

When the Qantas plane dived out of the sky & almost crashed, those passengers were compensated. It was the fault of poor computer design. This is a case of poor curb design. Poor design & poor maintenance (potholes) are not the fault of the driver!

So it was the passengers that were compensated by Qantas for poor computer design that was actually not their doing - did the plane's manufacturer compensate Qantas for their compensating of others? I highly doubt it - Qantas was trying to repair their reputation that was on the line. Totally different scenario!

What if your driving along in a car park at a cautious speed, being alert etc, & some idiots trolley goes out of control & hits your car, smashing a headlight & denting panels...I bet any money you'd be after Blood! Wanting your repairs to be paid for. Well, by your reasoning, its YOUR fault for being there, you should have been going even slower & in fact now YOU OWE the supermarket a new trolley!!!

Ok, Matt, I realise this person is a mate of yours and the tyre costs a lot of money - but she was driving the car and a part of driving the vehicle is to keep it on the black top to avoid such damage to the vehicle or crashes in general. Were you with her when it happened? I know mates will tone things down so the story is in their favour, but unless you were there you don't know what "I wasn't going fast" really was - their version of not going fast could be a pot load quicker than your version of "not going fast"...

Unfortunately I highly doubt that anyone other than the driver, or their insurance company will be paying for the damage to their vehicle.

You always need to be alert about what's going on around you and what's around you that could be a potential hazard as you drive, this includes drive throughs - it doesn't matter how fast or slow you're going, as the driver the responsibility resides with you.

Cheers

Bennie

 

[Rally]

Bennie, i think you are right. There are some drivers out there who would hit it even if it had strobe lights fitted. A mates dad was in the NSW HWP. He was standing in front of his marked HWP car, with lights flashing and someone ran into the back of it. My thoughts are that people need to pay more attention to their driving and from my observations too many clearly do not. Sure, on a wet night it might be quite difficult to see, but these things are happening on clear fine days as well. We seem as a society to removing responsibility from ourselves, blaming it on others and heading off to court to seek compensation. Anyway, I still am not convinced it was not a tyre failure- or perhaps more correctly I am not convinced the kerb caused the damage to the tyre.

 

[NachaLuva]

And if they were really smart they would have a) parked the car and walked in or b) supported the local sandwich bar for a healthy alternative.

I knew someone was going to mention that...The purpose of a drivethru isnt to park the car & walk in...its to drive through! lol. It should be designed, built & maintained in a way that makes it EASY & SAFE to do so. Which this one wasnt. A lot of drivethrus are narrow...this one is absurdly narrow with a ridiculous approach!

This is simple passing of the blame. If this drive through is build with similar features of other drive throughs you would think that people would learn to be careful when using them.

Thats the point Bennie, its not!. You have to make a sharp right angle turn in less than one car length. In some cars it would not be possible! In hers ('09 Ford G6), probably not. Plus there were large, deep potholes to be avoided.

So it was the passengers that were compensated by Qantas for poor computer design that was actually not their doing - did the plane's manufacturer compensate Qantas for their compensating of others? I highly doubt it - Qantas was trying to repair their reputation that was on the line. Totally different scenario!

I'm not sure if it was Qantas or Boeing who made the compensation...either way it was ultimately Qantas' responsibility as the service provider to ensure all of their suppliers/parts, etc, are properly designed & maintained. It certainly wasnt a PR stunt as they wanted as little PR as possible...no airline does for their mistakes lol.

It is the same as it relates to poor design/manufacture/maintenance.

Unfortunately I highly doubt that anyone other than the driver, or their insurance company will be paying for the damage to their vehicle.

I do expect someone to pay for the damages. Although I wasnt there when it happened I know she is a very safe driver who not only never speeds but in fact drives 5kmh BELOW the speed limit. She's very cautious & responsible.

As I took the photos, the white car you see in one actually did run over the curb! As one of 2 cars I watched go through...thats 50% (yes I know, only 2 cars) but it demonstrates that this isnt an isolated incident...its common, as proven by the layer of tyre rubber on the curb AND the numerous deep gashes in the concrete.

or perhaps more correctly I am not convinced the kerb caused the damage to the tyre.

Yeah I'm pretty sure it was the curb, there was black tyre marks on the rim which I cleaned off without thinking I should have left them there for the photo. Either that or the potholes, but I think the curb

OK, I understand you all have your opinions & I personally dislike it when people blame others for their mistake. I believe the flood of trivial law suits is disgusting! BUT...all councils/ business owners need to ENSURE their properties are safe, both for person & property.

....

I"m a bit disappointed that Sam is being attacked for her driving when you dont even know her, or the dimensions of the drivethru. Even in our little Subies it would be difficult to go through there without rubbing the front of the car against the shrubs on the far side or tyre on the curb.

Yes I'm protective of her but that has nothing to do with bad design/build/maintenance. BTW, have you noticed how often I've mentioned "design/build/maintenance"...that is whats important here.

If any of you were driving along & hit a deep pothole around a blind corner, bending your steering, factory alloy rim, tyre, etc, you would have every right to seek compensation from the council as they didnt maintain the road in a safe condition. Its their responsibility to do so. & if you didnt, then its your loss & I would suggest you're foolish not to.

 

[El_Freddo]

A lot of drivethrus are narrow...this one is absurdly narrow with a ridiculous approach!

...You have to make a sharp right angle turn in less than one car length. In some cars it would not be possible! In hers ('09 Ford G6), probably not. Plus there were large, deep potholes to be avoided.

If you take a look at the older drive throughs out there I'm sure you'll find many are hazardous to use. I'm also pretty sure you'll find that you use these facilities at your own risk.

I do expect someone to pay for the damages. Although I wasnt there when it happened I know she is a very safe driver who not only never speeds but in fact drives 5kmh BELOW the speed limit. She's very cautious & responsible.

As I've said, she won't have a leg to stand on and it will be either her or her insurance that will be paying. Harsh but true.

OK, I understand you all have your opinions & I personally dislike it when people blame others for their mistake. I believe the flood of trivial law suits is disgusting! BUT...all councils/ business owners need to ENSURE their properties are safe, both for person & property.

This is where you also need to be careful - they might counter sue for damage to their paint job on the curb

I"m a bit disappointed that Sam is being attacked for her driving when you dont even know her, or the dimensions of the drivethru. Even in our little Subies it would be difficult to go through there without rubbing the front of the car against the shrubs on the far side or tyre on the curb.

But you've asked for our opinions - isn't that the reason for this thread? And we're not the ones you should be concerned about - it's the joint where she did the damage that will be the one that tells you it was driver error!

Yes I'm protective of her but that has nothing to do with bad design/build/maintenance. BTW, have you noticed how often I've mentioned "design/build/maintenance"...that is whats important here.

Maybe she should take it up with ford for poor vehicle design resulting in her not being able to safely negotiate the drive through entry.

If any of you were driving along & hit a deep pothole around a blind corner, bending your steering, factory alloy rim, tyre, etc, you would have every right to seek compensation from the council as they didnt maintain the road in a safe condition. Its their responsibility to do so. & if you didnt, then its your loss & I would suggest you're foolish not to.

I highly doubt this! I've never heard of a council paying out for damaged rims/tyres/vehicles due to road conditions - as soon as they pay out for one tyre/rim/whatever damage due to their "poor road conditions" you'll see two things happen: Rates will go through the roof and the flood gates will be open for many more compensation claims against the council for damage to vehicles.

And I'm sure if you took it up with the council they'd want solid proof that it was that pot hole and that you were doing the speed you say you were doing - how can they know you didn't run your rim into the curb several times previous and the pot hole finished off the underlying damage??

This is why you need to remain vigilant when driving!

I'm on this path as recently I've had too many vehicles that have caused a near hit (not a near miss as this would be a hit!) situation. People cutting the corner off at T intersections when turning into the intersecting road that has to giveway or stop before proceeding - and it's my fault as they eyeball me while cutting the corner that could have been my vehicle a second or two earlier; I had a guy last sunday completely miss the giveway sign at a "slip lane" beside a set of traffic lights - which is not actually a slip lane but is a T intersection by law. Had I not seen him earlier he would have had the front of my wife's car on his lap, he ended up a sitting duck in the middle of my lane as other traffic was in the right hand lane; and just last night I had a woman come around a corner halfway on my side of the road - a tight corner, double lines, 40km/h caution warning sign, I was coming down the steep hill (straw's lane headed down from Mt Macedon) engine braking at 60km/h just started braking using the foot brake as she was halfway if not more in my lane starting up the hill after this left hand corner (for me) - had I been travelling any faster or had been using my brakes all the way down the hill it would have been another story - no time to brake to avoid the collision or no brakes left due to brake fade, the downside of driving an auto if you're not careful.

Now to you this is all hear-say, but I was there as it happened to me. I've got a gut feeling that there's a much worse stack waiting for me around the corner, more so now than ever before after a series of incidents like those of the above. It's not a good feeling I can assure you that. Thus I remain vigilant with my driving. I'm also over being eyeballed for something I have not done wrong - usually coming from the offending individual!!

And, the last one for this post - I'm over people blaming others for their incompetence, even if it's an "incompetence moment" for a split second when the whole situation unravels into a complete mess. People need to take responsibility for their own actions!

Driving is a privilege, not a right and a life skill that I think is not valued as it used to be which is very unfortunate. People need to remember this.

End rant, but now you know where I'm coming from.

Cheers

Bennie

 

[mr turbo]

Comeon guys lets not argue or fight, look at both sides.

I agree !!

This thread is starting to get a little FUBAR.

Lets all just settle down or I'll have to will shut it down !!

Regards
Mr Turbo

 

[d_generate]

If any of you were driving along & hit a deep pothole around a blind corner, bending your steering, factory alloy rim, tyre, etc, you would have every right to seek compensation from the council as they didnt maintain the road in a safe condition. Its their responsibility to do so. & if you didnt, then its your loss & I would suggest you're foolish not to.

If said pothole had a big white circle painted around it and a sign saying POTHOLE AHEAD just like the drive through was painted white and had a big sign saying DRIVE THROUGH and I hit it I'd actually feel like a bit of a dick ....... and I'm pretty sure the council would just give you their lawyer's phone number.

 

[NachaLuva]

As I've said, she won't have a leg to stand on and it will be either her or her insurance that will be paying. Harsh but true.

Sorry Bennie, you're wrong there. I'll prove you wrong.

This is where you also need to be careful - they might counter sue for damage to their paint job on the curb

haha lol

I highly doubt this! I've never heard of a council paying out for damaged rims/tyres/vehicles due to road conditions - as soon as they pay out for one tyre/rim/whatever damage due to their "poor road conditions" you'll see two things happen: Rates will go through the roof and the flood gates will be open for many more compensation claims against the council for damage to vehicles.

Sorry Bennie, they do on a regular basis. Its probably the only incentive to fix potholes...why else would they?

Just as if a footpath has raised edges & someone trips & is injured, the council is fully liable. I'm certain you must have heard of this!

And I'm sure if you took it up with the council they'd want solid proof that it was that pot hole and that you were doing the speed you say you were doing - how can they know you didn't run your rim into the curb several times previous and the pot hole finished off the underlying damage??

This is a very good point & will be the most difficult part. But you have no idea how determined I can be lol. I will prove I am right!

I'm on this path as recently I've had too many vehicles that have caused a near hit (not a near miss as this would be a hit!) situation. People cutting the corner off at T intersections when turning into the intersecting road that has to giveway or stop before proceeding - and it's my fault as they eyeball me while cutting the corner that could have been my vehicle a second or two earlier; I had a guy last sunday completely miss the giveway sign at a "slip lane" beside a set of traffic lights - which is not actually a slip lane but is a T intersection by law. Had I not seen him earlier he would have had the front of my wife's car on his lap, he ended up a sitting duck in the middle of my lane as other traffic was in the right hand lane; and just last night I had a woman come around a corner halfway on my side of the road - a tight corner, double lines, 40km/h caution warning sign, I was coming down the steep hill (straw's lane headed down from Mt Macedon) engine braking at 60km/h just started braking using the foot brake as she was halfway if not more in my lane starting up the hill after this left hand corner (for me) - had I been travelling any faster or had been using my brakes all the way down the hill it would have been another story - no time to brake to avoid the collision or no brakes left due to brake fade, the downside of driving an auto if you're not careful.

I'm sorry to hear of this, just a few days ago I was run off my lane into (fortunately empty) car parking spaces...by an ambulance of all things!

But if any of these had been "hits" not "near hits", they would have been at fault not you. What would you have done? shrugged & said "my fault" despite them hitting you on your side of the road? No way!

I've got a gut feeling that there's a much worse stack waiting for me around the corner,

I sincerely hope not Bennie

Lets all just settle down or I'll have to will shut it down !!

I hope you dont, I want others to know you dont have to put up with poor maintenance, whether its from a council or corporation. I would like to be able to post the results...

We should all stick up for our rights.

Some would say its the only way to "keep the *******s honest" lol

 

[pezimm]

What do you think our chances are of getting money from either?

Back to the original question: I think your chances are slim, very slim... (that's what you asked for: our opinions on your chances, right?)

I won't add to the discussion about who's at fault. All I have to say is that, at the very least, she needs to be glad the damages are purely material...

Surely no one likes to have to either fork out the cash for repairs or chase third parties to do so, but at the end of the day all damage here is fixable and all parts replaceable.

Not everyone is this lucky running into potentially ill-designed or poorly maintained roads/streets when they are potentially just a tiny bit less concentrated. Some find that a split-second distraction combined with a pot-hole, oil spill, a wombat crossing the road, or a less than ideal tyre can result in irreplaceable damage to the people in and around the car.

Cheers,
Pedro.