Things to look out for, SF GT

t.ridden

t.ridden

Forum Member
Joined
Jan 25, 2014
Messages
240
Location
Serpentine, West Aus.
Car Year
1993
Car Model
L Series
Transmission
5sp D/R F/4WD Manual
Hi all,

Sorry I've been a bit quiet on here, moving house and starting back at uni has taken my time away D: (and my internet connection for a week or two!)

After some advice, I'm after a new(er) daily driver, as my Mazda is getting a tad unreliable and isn't awful fun to drive. Realistically, it probably just needs some TLC, but the departments of finance (mum) and of war (the girlfriend) are both encouraging me to get something "better".

So of course, I've hunted around and found an MY99 Foz GT in the right $$ range.
208***kms, manual 5sp, S/R AWD, EJ20J, SLS rear, etc, you know what they are.
Bog stock, no mods that I've been told or seen, looks stock height.
I'm heading to look at it and test drive tomorrow, pics I've seen show straight green body, no obvious paint fade or rust.
Interior is "immaculate" I was assured over the phone (so I'll be skeptical!)
Also according to the dealer it "drives beautiful mate".
Its from a dealer, so I'll be getting the best possible warranty with it, then driving it lots to find all the little faults that need to be fixed :P

Main issue I have, stopping me just going there and handing over the cash, is the lack of written service history.
Being a turbo motor, I'd much prefer to have a full history behind it (and shall be using this as a haggling point :twisted:).
First thing I'd do after purchase is get a full service and inspection done by a Subaru specialist (got a few I know from Rallying), to cover the bases.

So, the point of this post, who's had an SF GT and what would you say to one who is looking to buy one for a "fun" daily and occasional gravel road use/camping?
And what are signs of common problems to look out for?
Especially those from poor maintenance?

Cheers all :)

and yes, Scooby is still staying :) , and no the EJ isn't in yet :( ... SOON!
 
Gidday Tom

No service history ...

Turbo ...

= don't touch it with a 40 foot barge pole with a condom on both ends ...

From my Batphone
 
PauSum said:
Does this help?

Buying used
Click to expand...

It does!
Thank you

Ratbag said:
Gidday Tom

No service history ...

Turbo ...

= don't touch it with a 40 foot barge pole with a condom on both ends ...

From my Batphone
Click to expand...

That was my natural reaction too Ratbag, but I figure I'll have a look, its only a few minutes down the highway.
Theres a few for the same price with service history but private sale and usually lightly modified...will keep this in mind though.
If it has any sign of obvious neglect, I wont touch it.
^hence asking, whats an obvious sign of neglect.
Will be checking coolant and oil, turbo play, bearings and steering, suspension, the usual.
 
G'day again Tom

Bear in mind that the 2.5L N/A MT SG is only slightly slower than the SF Turbo 0-100 kmh. With none of the problems that you may face with an SF turbo that's been flogged.

I would also venture to say that the SG N/A would have a lot flatter torque curve.
 
As for signs of problems - don't forget to run all the body seams with your fingers to see if any have been bent badly.

Check the exhaust pipe. It it's black and/or oily, then the engine is already cactus.
If it's light brown and hard, the engine has been running too lean, so will be on its way to being cactus.
It should be a dry dark grey to black, with no hint of oiliness.

Make sure you sit in the back seats and check that all the pull out bits work and aren't broken or otherwise damaged.

Check the condition of the carpets in all foot wells. If worn badly suspect abuse.

Check the wear on the accelerator, clutch and brake pedals. Even at 200K+ kms, they should not be badly worn. If they look new, get mightily suspicious ...

Check that all mirrors, seatbelts, windows, locks, switches, lights, wipers, central locking and the like work.

Grovel under the car and check all the mechanicals you can eye-ball or feel, including the steering rack boots and suspension parts.

Run your fingers along the underneath of the inside of all the doors between the seal and the outer skin.

Remove the spare when you inspect the boot. Check that all parts are present (jack, jack handle, spare ... ;) ), and that there is no sign of water past or present in the spare wheel well.

Check the wheel bearings for tightness by rocking the car back and forth vigorously while stationary. Take it for a drive, and listen for the tell-tale sounds of CV joints, and the clonking of loose wheel bearings when cornering. Wheel bearings that are on the way out will make a quiet to loud grinding noise.

Check for wandering or vagueness in the steering.

I'm sure that you have thought of most if not all these items, but it never hurts to say them nonetheless.
 
Fun daily? Buy an NA MX5.

The GT will be essentially the same car as the EJ converted scoobie, a 4wd, 4 door, mid powered wagon. Why have 2?
 
MX5? Tom's not gay. But I do agree that the GT will be too similar to EJ Scooby.

If you do get any subaru, check for the oil leak to see the owners attitudes to maintenance. And any car check for paint orange peel for any resprays to hide damage.
 
Hahaha funny you should mention the MX-5 stilson, I was looking at them! Would love an NA, if this foz has any issues, I'll keep looking. Flip-up headlights FTW

Ratbag, thanks for the list, saves me writing it out, and I'd no doubt forget something! Having driven an SG2.5, they do have an excellent torque curve (until you fit a single mass flywheel, it kinda kills them under 3.5k rpm), but the GT still beats it.
The EJ20J in the SF GT is not the same as the 20G in a WRX, the turbo and cams are optimised for low-mid range drivability rather than top-end.

As for having 2 of essentially the same car, what can I say, I know what i like :P

3 outcomes from inspection of the GT
1) it's amazing and near-faultless, I buy it
2) Its pretty good, will think about it and price up repairs/replacements
3) Nope nope nope

going to look tomorrow at this stage, will let you all know :)
 
Don't buy a turbo subaru without a service history. You have been warned.
GT's are good cars but sre getting old. If you look arpund for the 8k mark you can get a SG XT which is a much better car all round. Go for stock on slightly modified. Get manual, not auto.
The GT's are getting old now too, so even if they have low'ish km they are still fairly worn.


If you don't mind abit of work, get something with a blown motor and throw a low km Japanese spec block in.

Also it should be ej205 not ej202, ej201, ej20j, ej20e (these are all N/A POS).
 
Gidday Taz

taza said:
Don't buy a turbo subaru without a service history. You have been warned.
GT's are good cars but sre getting old. If you look arpund for the 8k mark you can get a SG XT which is a much better car all round. Go for stock on slightly modified. Get manual, not auto.
The GT's are getting old now too, so even if they have low'ish km they are still fairly worn.


If you don't mind abit of work, get something with a blown motor and throw a low km Japanese spec block in.

Also it should be ej205 not ej202, ej201, ej20j, ej20e (these are all N/A POS).
Click to expand...

I couldn't agree more, Taza!

Except that I would also stay clear of turbo motors. People keep saying how reliable they are, and how they don't cost any more to run ... Then I see posts about how it "only" cost $1,600 to fix broken turbo valves, etc, etc. Sometimes the post made by the same person who was saying about how they are as cheap to own/run as a N/A donk ... Go figure :confused: :rolleyes: :shake:!!

For the same sort of money, one can get an MY06 N/A 5MT/DR X model (or other series II SG), often with one of the special 'option packs' that Subaru offer from time to time. This often brings the car up to almost the same specs as the XS models, which generally command a premium price point for whatever year.

The motors in the MY06 to MY08 (EJ-253; and also in the MY09/MY10 SH) have a great torque curve that makes them extremely tractable to drive (what most of us do, most of the time ... ), and go well and truly fast enough to get any of us into serious trouble with the constabulary ... :(.
 
I have my JDM 2.0l turbo outback you can buy if you want. Cheap cheap. :raz:

Seriously though I have both an sf forester and a gen 3 outback. The SFs are starting to get really dated to be a new daily. Drivability wise the power isn't that much better than an SG/ outback 2.5NA in stock form IMO. Low RPM (under 2500) the 2.5 will blow a gt off the road. My outback has 205KW, FAR more than a gt and with AVCS and still low end is beaten by a 2.5NA. For similar money you could probably pick up a nice sg NA (or my outback :raz:).

Don't get me wrong a good turbo motor is fantastic when its got balls and fairly low kms (such as mine). But a gt...not so much IMO. Especially as they are getting a bit long in the tooth.

Fuel economy wise I don't get any worse with my turbo than I did with the 2.5. Even driving fairly hard.

If your heart is set on the gt though, I'd definitely stick to one with service history, and as low kms as possible.
 
Davidov said:
Fuel economy wise I don't get any worse with my turbo than I did with the 2.5. Even driving fairly hard.
Click to expand...

But, and it's a big BUT, you have to use 98 RON. I don't know about over in the west, but here in Vic, it is almost always at least 10¢ more per litre, and often 20¢ more than 91 RON. That's a lot more expensive, even if all else remains the same. Otherwise I agree with everything you have said.

Before anyone starts it up, I have done tests using 95 and 98 RON in both my Impreza and the Camry. Both cars had an ECU that would re-tune the motor to run on the higher octane fuel. However, it made no difference to economy in either, and no noticeable difference to the performance. IOW, just pouring money down the drain.

I figure that the engines are designed to run on 91 RON; do so perfectly adequately; no performance or economy gains to be had; costs about 15% more (on average) to use 95/98 RON; so why bother?
 
Ratbag I run Ron98 or 100 in all my vehicles all the time... I don't see it as an issue..
I'd personally never buy another non turbo subaru. Qhen they offer such a quality factory turbo option in nearly all vehicles. While my 2.5l ia a strong motor. Its certainly no turbo. I find my fuel economy is similar to a turbo wngine. I personally average 430km to a tank, every tank. I find this pretty bad for a small 4 cylinder which you compare it to a SG XT..

Daves car is a good buy. A gen 3 OB is much nicer than a SF. Its much after too. Ptobably similar to a VY commodore 5.7l v8. Im sure he'd do you a good deal.

I can guarantee that it returns around 11l per 100km anf is very smooth, responsive and fast.
 
Last edited:
Ratbag said:
But, and it's a big BUT, you have to use 98 RON. I don't know about over in the west, but here in Vic, it is almost always at least 10¢ more per litre, and often 20¢ more than 91 RON. That's a lot more expensive, even if all else remains the same. Otherwise I agree with everything you have said.
Click to expand...

I have to run 100 actually (which happens to be cheaper than BP 98 by a significant margin anyway). And even so I run 100 in all my cars.

Its true though that at least there is the option to run 91 in an NA. But if considering a turbo car I think the little extra is worth it for the enjoyment. If your not buying a turbo car to enjoy it there's no point whatsoever.

Best I got on a highway run was 8/100. My 2.5 would have never gotten that.
 
Tom, If you live south of the river and this GT is at a car yard, get a pre - inspection done by Dougie at STechnics in Maddington. They will give you a no Bull...t report and tell it as it should be.

Now for my opinion in the matter. Generally you Don't buy any car, turbo or n/a if it does not have a service history, especially a Subaru and even then that is no guarantee.

The 2.0 litre turbo motor is a reliable unit compared to the 2.5 turbo and also very cheap too replace. It will cost you 8 to 10 thousand dollars to rebuild a 2.5xt depending on parts. It will cost you 4 thousand to buy and install a second hand Japanese 2.5xt motor.

Both run on premium unleaded fuel, 95 RON, from factory, both can be lightly modded, and retuned to take advantage of the better bowser fuels available. (98 and 100 ron)

Everything else besides engine oil and spark plugs will be the same on the Subaru for replacement parts. If you do proceed to purchase a GT or XT, you will more than likely never go back to a N/A engine again, regardless of displacement and cylinder numbers.

Then you will understand why Taza said he will never buy a non turbo Subaru again. I agree.
 
Thanks all, it's helpful, gotta dash now to go see it though. :P

catchya, i know dougie, do you think he'd come all the way to Mandurah?
might give him a ring and ask tomorrow if it's any good.

Thanks again all, will update :)
 
Davidov, i have 5k-ish to play with...does your OB fall into that bracket?
 
My Falcon wagon falls into that bracket! Looks identical to Chris's wagon but with 181xxxkms, and can include an RTV conversion (minus diff lock and tramp rods) aswell :D


Good luck with the inspection Tom!
 
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