Down Down Down..

taza

taza

Forum Member
Joined
Oct 30, 2010
Messages
3,820
Location
Perth, Western Australia
Thinking of going down with my lift kit.

After having my ute damaged in a carpark and insurance taking car of it, I started thinkning about the Forester.
While it's absolutely awesome with the big lift kit, I feel that insurance won't cover in an incident. Even if it isn't my fault....
I've been loosing sleep over the whole thing for about a week now.

It normally runs raised Dobinson springs(30mm), 50mm blocks up front and 65mm blocks in the rear.

All up 3" in the front and 4" in the back. Plus I run oversize 225/70R15 tyres vs the standard 205/70R15.

If I pulled out the raised springs for some standard height Kings(although I'd rather stay with dobinsons), I would then be running 50mm up front and 65mm in the rear. However 15mm or a finger nails length isn't going to be an issue. If I did this then it would be legal.
I have just changed to AAMI insurance as they seem well suited to my needs(cover modifications, good cover value, good excess, decent premiums for a 21yr old male). They stated in writing that I am covered in all legal areas offroad and all my modifications and accessories are covered as long as they are legal and meet WA DOT regulations.

While I'd like to keep the big lift kit, getting it engineered is very costly. Especially since it's not off the shelf. They go through all the body roll tests, brake tests, etc.... which is thousands. While with 2" it's covered, end of story.

I'm in the process of getting a modification plate for my EJ25 conversion. That's another kettle of fish though.

What are peoples thoughts on this? Run the risk and keep the lift. Or loose the springs and sleep well at night.
 
taza said:
What are peoples thoughts on this? Run the risk and keep the lift. Or loose the springs and sleep well at night.
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I think the sleep well at night answers your own question. If it worries you that much then loose the lift. Insurance companies will worm their way out of paying any way they can. I wouldn't loose the springs though I would go for smaller blocks. The springs are 30mm plus a 3/4 inch block would have your lift just a bees dick under 2 inch. I just think that it is more structurally sound to run as little blocks as possible.

If you want standard springs (not king springs) though, I have a set for an SG sitting in my shed doing nothing that you can have.
 
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Keep the blocks, lose the springs.
The blocks have the camber correction in them.
The springs are making your suspension sit too high in the shock stroke anyway IMNSHO.

Fit standard fronts and maybe a HD rear set and then you could go softer on your rear antirollbar - more articulation, less strain on your suspension components.

win win win win win.
 
stilson said:
Keep the blocks, lose the springs.
The blocks have the camber correction in them.
The springs are making your suspension sit too high in the shock stroke anyway IMNSHO.

Fit standard fronts and maybe a HD rear set and then you could go softer on your rear antirollbar - more articulation, less strain on your suspension components.

win win win win win.
Click to expand...

Interesting difference of opinion in what to do. I will have to see how the raised springs go when I finally go offroad. I didn't know that Taza's blocks had the correction in them, with that in mind I'd probably loose the springs as well.
 
Gidday Taza

I think that you are right to be concerned.

They stated in writing that I am covered in all legal areas offroad and all my modifications and accessories are covered as long as they are legal and meet WA DOT regulations.
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Over here in the eastern states, "legal" usually means some kind of surveyed road or track that's open to the public for vehicles of the kind being used.

However, that last sentence from your insurer covers more than a multitude of sins ...

Firstly, I would encourage you to make your car as legal as possible, because IMNSHO it doesn't come close ATM.

Secondly, once you have done that, send photos and a list of repairs and modifications to your insurer and get them to incorporate those into your policy document.

No point whatsoever in paying for insurance that's voidable at the drop of a hat - and being un-insured is just not an option.
What can be a great worry is voiding of the TPPD component of your policy; and the possibility of voiding your compulsory TPPI insurance that you pay with your rego.

If it is necessary to comply with all these requirements, get your car engineered. This will probably cost you a poultice, but better that than losing everything you own and being put into bankruptcy just because of one prang!
 
Everything on the vehicle is legal at the present moment, except for the ej25 conversion. However I'm doing the paper work for that as we speak.
It currently only has raised springs which are 25mm.

While I will now run 2x sets of tyres. An offroad set (28") and a standard highway tyre set on 16" alloys. I am not concerned about the wheel adding clearance as they will only be ran on the occasion I go out.

by adding 25mn blocks to the front and 35mm to the rear it'd be legal. With running large tyres it would have enough clearance. Just not bucket loads. It was good being able to see the number plate of the car infront under my car, however it did greatly affect the handling and stability of my car.
 
Gidday Taza

taza said:
It was good being able to see the number plate of the car infront under my car, however it did greatly affect the handling and stability of my car.
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That's why none of the insurers, private or statutory, will cover a vehicle (or its driver ... ) with these kinds of mods.

None of us really have the knowledge that's necessary to modify vehicles this way, while preserving all the obvious and not so obvious primary and secondary safety attributes of the particular car.

My '68 LC didn't have any of the above, so it didn't really matter ... :poke: :rotfl:.
Modern cars are bristling with systems and design attributes that enhance the primary and secondary safety. That's why the ADRs exist - to prevent modifications that will significantly impact on the operation of these systems, whether we are aware of that impact, or not. like all safety systems, they have to err on the side of caution.

The ADRs and far better car design and safety have dropped the road toll in Victoria from nearly 2,000 per annum in my youth to around 300 per annum today. Multiply that figure by about 10x for serious injuries. This in spite of the huge increase in population during that time; and the huge increase in miles driven p.a.

That's also why a WLL for a rated device like my creeper winch is 2400 Kgs, but the SWL is only 1600 Kgs. By its nature, a dead lift is far more dangerous than a rolling load; thus the far greater margin for safety.
 
Taza it sounds like the wisdom of age kicking in, and need to lose the restless nights.

I reckon you have a good plan to change the wheels over between off-road and on-road, something I have been chewing, the challenge/hesitation I have in having oversized tyres on is in getting to where I can get off the black top.
Being caught up in an incident with another car means a bunch of lawyers at the insurance companies start running around finding ways to not pay or to force the other party to pay - a whole lot of grief where the only winners are a bunch over overpaid lawyers with their snouts in the trough!

I suspect many readers will be keen to know how much the engineering cert costs for the new engine.
 
Well funny enough I got the paperwork back from the department of transport today.

The modification has been pre-approved. Its valid for 2 years. Reading over the documents I found a number of errors; my name spelt wrong..., called it an Impressa when its a forester! Plus some other things..
I have to complete thw modification then get the vehicle examined by an eengineer.
There are 5 main aspects the engineer has to check over. Since it will ve remaining stock, at first anyway I will be using all the stock, exhaust, cats, etc thus an emissions test will not be necessary. With the engine being newer it will have better emissions than the factory engine anyway.

My nwxt step ia to contact an engineer and speak to them about what's involved in t house is whole 'engineering' process.
I bet he's a fancy mechanic, looks over it, checks everything is fixed as it should be. Take it for a spin. Then prints a pre made letter and signs it.
Hopefully not at a ridiculous price....

Then preform the mod.
 
It's mainly emissions and to check nothing dangerously stupid has been done. Mine went through very easily, as they said it looked factory. I failed on noise and metal center steering wheel. Just make sure you shop around, have a good chat to them and find someone agreeable to what you're doing. I was lucky there was a good business locally in Ballarat.
 
Ok good to hear. This is all a new process with me.. I'll ring around and go from there.
Did you get modification permit or plate?
Did tgey just look at tge conversion or go over the whole car?

I'm assuming you went through tge same process with the lift kit?
 
Taza. Give Terry Southam from Southam Automative Engineering a call and discuss. Excellent automotive engineer and reasonably priced.
 
after writing off two cars now taza, not once has the insurance company inspected the car to see if it was legal, the panel beaters took some photos once for a quote but that was it.

im sure it would be different however if someone was killed or injured
 
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