an interesting bit of info

scarhead

scarhead

Forum Member
Joined
Jun 23, 2014
Messages
23
Location
Lalor, Victoria, Australia
Car Year
1987
Car Model
Brumby
Transmission
4 speed maunal
i was doing some research for the purposes of finding a way to reinforcing the front of my Brumby so i can install a winch and stumbled across this...

i will also add, i COULD NOT find, no matter how i worded it, anything on damaging the front of your vehicle from winching, unless you winch at a strange angle...

i'm now not gonna worry about reinforcing any more.. after reading this and having a few expert opinions, i'm happy that it will all work out fine..

https://www.l2sfbc.com/rmp/blog/Monocoque-4X4-unibody-construction-chassis
 
Thats an interesting article but it doesnt mention winches.

There are many cases of big fourbies ripping the bullbar off the chassis when winched incorrectly. Mostly by trying to pull a heavy 4WD up over a steep ledge with a big 12,000lb winch. There are limitations to the strength of the mounting points for the bar!

Same goes for a Subie, esp a L series, MY or Brumby which dont have the best bullbar anchorage points. I would certainly look for a way to attach the bar to the chassis in as strong a way as possible, even reinforce the chassis.

Have a look what Dedman did:
Dedmans Winch
 
i did mention about doing damage if you winch from a strange angle... winches are designed to pull in a forward direction to an angle of around 30 degrees in any direction.. anything outside this increases the chance of causing damage..
having said that, i don't intend to just haphazardly mount my winch to my bumper, i'm just not as concerned as i previously was about the chassis not being strong enough..

when i'm done, i'll post step by step pics of how, what and where i mounted from..
 
Gidday SH

If you are attaching the winch to your front bar, and that is attached well at numerous points using high tensile steel bolts, you should not have a problem.

Most problems seem to arise from trying to move vehicles that are held fast by suction. In that situation, excavating under the vehicle and elevating it using an exhaust/air jack, then packing material under the wheels and excavating in front of them appears to be the recommended way to aid in recovery operations.

There is a huge difference between a rolling recovery and either a (partially) dead lift recovery or one where the vehicle is also held fast by suction.

However, there are reasons why Subaru strengthened the Forester body/sub-frame construction with the SG Series I and further with the Series II (AFAIK). Further again with the SH.

An L Series is a whole different ball game from the Forester series, and you must take that into account too.

Contact Bennie ("El Freddo"), who is probably the most expert person on this forum as far as knowing the L series inside out and back to front. He will be able to advise you on what's needed, and what's not.

BTW, the strongest passenger vehicle ever made by any maker (AFAIK) was the BMC/Leyland Austin 1800 and Kimberley series. These were built on the same floor pan, and one could fit the doors from one onto the other, although the cars were otherwise very different. It took 15,800 ft. lbs. per degree applied to the ends of the car to bend it one degree out of alignment.

Some comparative figures from the time: Falcon/Holden ~= 7,500; Valiant ~= 6,300; Volvo ~= 10,500; Mercedes Grosser 600 ~= 12,500; Rolls Royce Silver Shadow ~= 15,000 ...

Needless to say, all of these vehicles were unitary/monocoque construction.
 
^ ^ I agree with what NL said.

It is important with Foresters (and Subies in general) to use a load distribution strap between the front tie-down/recovery points when snatching, for example.

One must also be careful not to use the passing stranger in a 4 tonne LC's recovery snatch strap too.

The snatch gear should be that used with the lighter of the two vehicles, in order to avoid damage to either of them. Damage can and does happen, regardless of what some blogger states so blithely. It's not his vehicle! And no skin off his nose if you happen to damage yours badly!

Regardless of the inherent strength of any vehicle, it is very important to use proper equipment and safe methods to recover it.

For just one example, my creeper winch is capable of handling a dead lift of my (empty) 2006 SG Forester (i.e. straight up in the air, with no other support - it has a SWL of 1,600 Kgs when used in this manner). It is highly unlikely that my car would survive unscathed though. It might even just tear the front tie-down points off the vehicle ...
 
oh of course.... like with anything, common sense comes into play...
as i said to my wife.. "i don't plan on pulling a B-Double out of a table drain with it"

i've already started designing a winch mount that will bolt to both the standard bar mounts and the lower tie down points under the bumper, with sandwich plates in the chassis.

i'm buying a universal winch plate and welding my custom designed brackets to the ends.. then i will modify my alloy bull bar to fit over the top and bolt to the winch mount.. as basically just a cover.
i'm also going to make a bash plate that will bolt from the bottom of the winch mount to the original mounting points for the sump guard.. this should distribute the load even further..
 
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