Surface rust on the floor pan, should I be concerned?

randy

Forum Member
Joined
Feb 5, 2013
Messages
8
Location
Melbourne
Hey everyone,

Been looking to buy a forester for a while now. Ones come up that ticks all the boxes. Just got the RACV check back, & the only main issue is surface rust on the floor pan & suspension. Does anyone think this is a major issue? My thoughts is that is could have been in the drink, or parked near the sea. Everything else appears to be above board. Any thoughts are greatly appreciated, as I'm not the most car savvy person around.

Cheers to all!
 
Gidday Randy

First, a warm :welcome: to the ORS forum, mate.

Second, it helps if you put your general location in your user profile ... :iconwink:

Third, if the car you're looking at has "surface rust" on the floor pan, where else has it got "surface rust"?

Even at nearly 18 y.o., my '93 Impreza had no visible signs of such rust.
My Impreza did have to have rust cut out from around the windscreen, but that was due to damage arising from a windscreen replacement done some 10 years earlier ...

The pre-1993 Subarus had a rust problem. Subaru set out to fix this, and appear to have done so.

I would be inclined to look very, VERY closely at the car you are contemplating. Systemic rust in a car is the one thing that is all but impossible to fix :(.
 
Cheers ragbag.

Fixed location etc.

Thanks for taking the time to reply mate.

I guess I'll keep looking, prob best to err on the side of caution.

After months of looking one does tend to get rather excited tho.
 
G'day Randy :welcome:

I guess I'll keep looking, prob best to err on the side of caution.

After months of looking one does tend to get rather excited tho.

Yeah, good idea. Mine has taken a beating underneath but there's still no rust anywhere, so lots of rust would be a major warning sign :(

Its very easy to get over excited when buying cars. My advice is take your time. One will come up that is exactly what you want with all the features, the right price & the right maintenance history. Dont underestimate this, good maintenance will keep a Subie going for many 100,000kms, bad maintenance will always buy you expensive trouble. Check the service book...if its always stamped at the correct service interval...gold. If not, or if there isnt one, then I would move on...

Good luck :biggrin:
 
G'day again Randy

Cheers ragbag.

:rotfl:, mate - that's "Ratbag" ... :lol: :cool:

Fixed location etc.

Good oh. Local lad, I see :) :ebiggrin:

Thanks for taking the time to reply mate.

I guess I'll keep looking, prob best to err on the side of caution.

After months of looking one does tend to get rather excited tho.

I can well identify with that!
It took a lot of looking before I got Roo2 in December 2011 (101,000 kms, MY06 - 2006, one owner, delivered with about 3 kms on the clock, fully optioned XS); and ditto with RonnyRoo in mid-2012 (65,000 kms MY10 - 2009, one owner, delivered with about 2 kms on the clock, fully optioned XS). Both pre-ordered - not demonstrators (possibly the worst way to run in a car!).

FWIW, it helps to know exactly what you are looking for; how much it's likely to cost; and have the finance/dough ready to fly.

Watch carsales.com etc like a hawk. RonnyRoo was put up on the web at around 1900H on Friday night, I was booking an inspection at around 0903H on Saturday morning. I beat the other two hopefuls to it by about 5 minutes or so ...

Both ours were only available for a matter of hours. I had lost a couple because I had delayed as little as 18 hours ...

Good ones sell very quickly.

Two things kill cars: mileage and age. Both are equally deadly. Don't go for anything that's both old, and high mileage ...

If it doesn't look and feel right, leave it.

Expect to pay a fair price for a good car.

I paid about 60% of new price for RonnyRoo, and it has around 78% of its economic mileage and 83% of its lifespan left (assuming 300,000 kms and 18 years).

I paid about 43% of new price for Roo2, and it has around 66% of its economic mileage and 72% of its lifespan left (same assumptions ... ).

Perhaps I was an accountant in a former life ... :poke: :biggrin: :lol:.

Buying from dealers has its downside, but the price premium buys you some peace of mind as regards major faults with a car, clear title guaranteed, etc.
BUT Statutory warranty does not apply to private sales ... .

Hope some of this blather is of some help :iconwink:.
 
Doh....sorry raTbag. Damn iPhones when you have had too much coffee!

Really appreciate the advice. The search continues!

What's that saying? 'Patience is a virtue'. With $ ready to go, months of searching & the patience of a 6 year old in the build up to Christmas. It's best I breath deeply, & move on to the next one.
 
G'day again Randy

A few more things will help those of us who are willing to help you look (as others did for me when I was looking for RonnyRoo).

How much do you want to spend?

Model/Year?
Bear in mind that the engine and gearbox changed a lot in the MY06 SG onwards (series II). So did a lot of other things. Better lights for one. Also some of the extras that came with the XS, cost an unbelievable fortune to add to the base model ...

N/A or Turbo

Auto/Manual?

Tow bar?

etc.

Make your list. It makes things a LOT easier, IMO.

BTW, what does "too much coffee" mean :rotfl:.
 
This one looks a possible starter, but it's black.

Just about the worst colour for a car IMO. I had a black Wolseley for 18 months. Beautiful car. I got run into 6 times in 18 months. All the other drivers said the same thing "I didn't see you"!

One time was in broad daylight, sunny, stationary, parked at a petrol pump. A Cortina drove staight into the back of me ...

https://www.drive.com.au/used-cars/...=38605628&lid=38605628&pg=1&pp=10&d=0&from=53
 
You guys rock!

Ratbag, thanks heaps for having a look to see whats around. The first car you posted about is unfortunately out of my price range.

Looking around the $10k mark.
Auto (the mighty other half cant drive manual).
Not looking for the flashest forester around, something i can use to see this beautiful country (im a kiwi who as never seen so much flat land in my life).

Whats too much coffee? try doing a few cupping sessions (tasting freshly roasted coffee) back to back then hold a serious conversation!

But seriously I really appreciate your words of wisdom. I should have jumped on ORS long ago!

Cheers to all,

K
 
Randy, It's really easy to spend $4,000 on fixing/servicing a car that's only cost you $10,000 ...

Now, Roo2 was in near perfect condition, but needed tyres relatively quickly ($770, with full 4 wheel and body alignment check and adjust the former); a service ($200); a spare key ($128); sheep seats covers ($220). It is now due for the major 125K service (even though only at about 110,000 kms, so that will be around $1,200.

RonnyRoo was still under the OEM warranty, but has just had a 4 wheel brake job done ($548), and is nearly due for an in-between service ($200). Again, sheep skin seat covers for the front ($230). We both love these ... It's an auto SH, with the sports shift auto. It will be due for tyres in around 10K kms. They are 17", so around a grand there.

This sort of maintenance is always on-going. What you want to avoid is nasty surprises!!

And yeah. A Forester is an ideal car for what you want to do with it. That is one of the reasons I (finally) traded in Roo1 at 18 y.o. and 234,000 kms. On its last trip to Brisbane in the stinking heat and floods, it used no oil and no water in 4,500 kms. Good cars.
 
Gidday Randy

This looks like it could be good. 4EAT Auto (note that this is NOT the sports auto - so drive it like an auto, not like a manual ... ). 148K kms. $11,990. Dealer (they take trade-ins, so no need to get a roadworthy on your existing car if trading it). 12 months RACV "guarantee". Good colour ... Looks to be a pretty clean unit.

I always grovel under any car I'm looking at buying. Run all the body seams with my fingers looking for repair work. I also look for any sign of oil leaks from diff and gearbox, CV joints, etc. Look for damage/deformation of the floor pan and underneath generally.
Carefully examine the paintwork on all panels, looking for slight colour differences that might indicate an accident.
Check the colour of the light covers, they should all look the same. If one is "lighter and brighter" than the others, it indicates that it is new, and possibly the result of an accident.
Check the spare wheel and tyre, and then remove it from the wheel well and check for rust or water entry.

The advert states "2 airbags". It looks to me to be a "Luxury Pack" model, so look for the warning labels on the outside rear sides of the front seats for an air bag warning - "SRS Air bag" label sewn into the seat cover. The warning may be moulded into the centre pillar trim, I'm not sure. Some luxury pack models came with side air bags as well. A nice extra, if fitted.

It does not appear to have a tow bar, which may or may not be important to you.

Note all the extras - aero roof bars, deep dish cargo protector, rear bumper protector, side, door and corner body protection strips - these are surprisingly expensive items. That crappy piece of plastic that protects the rear bumper retails for about $180!

https://www.carsales.com.au/dealer/details/Subaru-Forester-2004/AGC-AD-14190024/?Cr=4&sdmvc=1

With both of ours, the dealers patently did not know what they had, and how much extra they could have charged (at least another grand each, perhaps a bit more). They didn't even bother to read the paperwork that came with both cars! This is one way of picking up a good deal, paying the same price as you would for a far lesser equipped model.

With the SH, the salesman only realised what a gem he was selling, and how many expensive extras it had when the deal was done and he was filling in the contract forms from the car's paper work! He said "Oh well, too late now!" ... :iconwink:.
We paid a fairly high price for the SH, but I was expecting to pay the same amount for a previous year's model, with about 35,000 kms more on the clock. And I was expecting to pay that price for a car without the tow bar, cargo protector, rear bumper protector strip, cargo barrier mounts, genuine OEM floor mats, and without locking aero roof bars. Were we happy? Yup ... :iconwink:.

I also cannot tell you how much comfort it gives me that both cars were delivered directly to their single owners by pre-order. Regardless of how they have been driven or treated by that owner, at least they haven't been driven by every second person and their dog, as a demo model has been. The first 1,000 kms are the most important in a car's life. But that's a long story for elsewhere ... ;) :lol:.
 
> 140K kms; make sure the timing belt, plugs, radiator and head gaskets have been changed at least once in it's lifetime! If not don't buy because that will be the reason for why the car is for sale.
 
^ I agree with Pigs about checking that the timing belt and plugs have been changed. Also about checking the service history. Look out for long gaps between services, mileage in particular.

Models prior to the MY06 have 25,000 kms service interval on the plugs. MY06 and on, it's 112,500 kms, and Platinum plugs.

Roo1 still had its original radiator and the head gaskets had never been touched at 18 y,o, and 234,000 kms.

Generally, head gaskets on modern cars do not leak, unless a design flaw (early 2.5L Foresters - 2002/2003), or the engine has been pulled apart and the head studs have not been tensioned properly, or in the correct order. An RACV test should give compression test results (may be an extra, these days - goes to show how rare a problem it is ... )
 
Note all the extras - aero roof bars, deep dish cargo protector, rear bumper protector, side, door and corner body protection strips - these are surprisingly expensive items. That crappy piece of plastic that protects the rear bumper retails for about $180!

https://www.carsales.com.au/dealer/details/Subaru-Forester-2004/AGC-AD-14190024/?Cr=4&sdmvc=1

151369987.jpg

My car exactly but with the OEM tow pack, basket, OEM bi-xenon and large rubber side strips included. Same condition as well. Great car!
 
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Gidday Pigs

What do you mean 'design flaw'?

Subject of a recall notice. Leaking head gaskets on the early 2.5L in the first year or so of the SG Forester. They replaced the head gaskets with a different design. There has been no systemic problem with leaking head gaskets since, AFAIK. Also AFAIK, there had never been one with Subarus before this one instance, but am happy to be corrected about either of those statements.

My 1970 Austin Kimberley had the same problem. The replacement gasket was a semi-bitumenised design, that sealed the head/block properly. My Kimberley was also sensitive to correct tensioning of the head studs/bolts (I can't remember which it had, it's a long time ago ... ). When I did the head gasket on one occasion, I tensioned them all down to finger tight in the correct sequence; then with the tension wrench at about 5 ft.lbs. ditto; then at 10 ft.lb. intervals to 45 ft.lbs. ditto; then one last go to spec at 70 ft.lbs ditto (IIRC ... ). Then one more very careful round at the same tension to ensure that all were equal. It never leaked again :iconwink:.

I have seen many mechanics just set their tension wrench to the spec figure, then rip each stud/bolt down in one hit! On one memorable occasion, I even saw a bloke just start at the front of the head and work his way back - bugger all that stuff about tensioning them in the correct order!
And they wonder why they get the car back, or don't, as the case may be ...
 
Subject to a recall in Australia? Were all cars done or only those showing leaks?
 
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