Hand Winches

joffa

Forum Member
Joined
Jul 12, 2008
Messages
35
Location
Northcote, Melb, Aust
Hi Folks,

What's a good brand of hand winch or is there something that members prefer? I have done some research of the web and other forums too but just thought I'd check here as well.

Also if I wanted something that might also cover a Nissan Patrol as well from time to time what's suitable? Will a 2.5T pulling winch do or do you need to go to something bigger. Think the patrol is 2.2T+.

Joffa.
 
Joffa
You have to remenber that even though your patrol is 2.2t when sitting on the ground but can way 3 times it weight when it's stuck in the mud.
Were as foresters may way 1.6t on the road it can also weigh up to 3 times it's wight if it's stuck in the mud.
The rule that i go by is the winch has to be able to have a pulling capacity of 11/2 times it's road weight so that when you use a block it doubles it's pulling power.
So if you want a hand wich that can do both just remember that it's better to have more than less.

That's my 41/2 cents worth.
 
Tirfor are probably the best you can get. the biggest has 3.2T lifting rating. their are some chinese ones around with different names such as "Big Haul" which are very good by reviews.
 
Arent they rated as "lifting capacity" - so yeah the Forester might weight 1.6t but a 2t rating should be capable of holding it off the ground.
So pulling a 1.6t on the flat is nothing like a 1.6t load.

Ok being stuck in mud or pulling up a slope, especially with say a step, it could easily be a higher load, but even then Id be pretty surprised if you got to 3 times its weight from being stuck in mud. But if you were that stuck then it probably doesnt depend on the weight of the vehicle - more the depth of mud and the shape of the vehicle. So its not like the mud is "this is 3 times weight mud"
 
yes they are all rated in a lifting capacity which is a SWL (safe working load). the actual MEAN BREAKING LOAD for a 3.2 Ton SWL would be about 5 times greater than that. BUT they do have sheer pins which will break at about 3.2 TONS stoping any more use untill the pin is replaced
 
dicknose said:
Arent they rated as "lifting capacity" - so yeah the Forester might weight 1.6t but a 2t rating should be capable of holding it off the ground.
So pulling a 1.6t on the flat is nothing like a 1.6t load.

Ok being stuck in mud or pulling up a slope, especially with say a step, it could easily be a higher load, but even then Id be pretty surprised if you got to 3 times its weight from being stuck in mud. But if you were that stuck then it probably doesnt depend on the weight of the vehicle - more the depth of mud and the shape of the vehicle. So its not like the mud is "this is 3 times weight mud"
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depends on how deep you are stuck and the texture of the mud your stuck in. a TON of mud is not a lot of mass. so if you have to push this mass as well as your car you can easily triple your weight. BUT you would have to be bogged down pretty deep in some thick mud to push that amount of mud. no one in their right mind would take a subie down that road. the guys that do the big 4WD comps use a 9-12K Lbs rated electric winch with big tyres and big engines. without the combo thet wouldn't have a chance off getting out without a shovel and a lot of time

P.S. there is about 20 cubic feet of dry sand to a TON (roughly)
 
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4wd monthly did a review/comparo late last year of all the available models in oz. I recall from the article that most brands (reputable brands, non ebay/diecast cheapies) such as T max, magnum, big haul, ox are all of similar build. All achieved the same result, it's just the ammount of effort to get the result that varied (strokes per metre / effort per stroke). I ended up getting an arb magnum hand winch whilst I was waiting for a bullbar to be built, thankfully I never used it as even the easy ones are heavy, take up room, are time consuming to setup & use and packing up wire rope is a pita. Unfortunately they are good self insurance. Whatever you go for make sure it has replacement pins included, and get at least one block and some winch extension straps while you are at it to make winching easier. Also check the length of the handle: longer = easier but longer stroke / shorter = less leverage but shorter stroke.

I suggest you work out what you think you will need in a setup (will you use it direct pull or do you want mechanical advantage via blocks, etc) including shackles to connect everything, blocks, straps then go shopping. Storage bags for the winch, handle and wire rope and blocks/shackles are also handy - most don't come with them or offer them.
A subaru with a lack of forward momentum isn't half the proposition of a cruiser or patrol, and all brand ones showed in the article were capable of pulling anything up a steep incline. The pins are the weak link in thse things so you shouldn't be overly concerned about breaking steel cable (all other things being hunky dory).
 
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article

Just found the article - 4x4 Australia Nov 07. Hope it helps.

Tested:
  • ARB
  • TJM
  • Busgranger
  • Opposite lock
  • Black rat
  • T-Max
  • Terrain Tamer
  • 4WD Megastores
The black rat and OL are similar to the tirfor and they don't have carry handles. They didn't seem to rate them highly, but they rated the OL the better of these two. All of the others are a tad different and all are virtualy identical on the outside. The T-max was their choice. They recon the bushranger, big haul and arb "were all a bit stiff in their setup operation, with the terrain tamer and TJM offerings less so".

All were rated at 1600kg which is ample.
 
eden said:
depends on how deep you are stuck and the texture of the mud your stuck in. a TON of mud is not a lot of mass. so if you have to push this mass as well as your car you can easily triple your weight.
Click to expand...
Its only triple the "weight" if you are lifting it.
You can drag a 10 tonne vehicle using a lot less than 10 tonnes of force.

P.S. there is about 20 cubic feet of dry sand to a TON (roughly)
Click to expand...
Yet you can move this with very little force is its in trailer. I could pull it along - but I cant lift 1 ton!

The mass of what you are pulling is a factor - but it doesnt correspond to the "load" when dragging.
That depends a lot more on friction.
Heck even dragging a car with no wheels probably requires less than its weight in force. As long as you are on a flat smooth road.

But put a bump in the way that you are trying to pull over and you can easily get a situation where the force required is much more than the mass of the vehicle (ie would be easier to lift it). Think of pushing a broom into a set of stairs - no amount of pushing will get it up the stairs.

My point - the "load" of dragging a car only vaguely corresponds to the mass of the car. It depends a lot more on HOW it is stuck than it does on the mass of the car.
So anyone using a rule of "the car weights X amount" is in danger of braking something.

A better idea on a winch would be to only get a winch that is rated to how you can attach it to the vehicle. Id rather the winch's sheer pin go than the bumper bend off the frame (or the frame bend)
 
Might be of some intrest:

Going of these tables (which are the only examples I can find at the moment - the army use to have something very similar but I cant find it).

From the Tables: Say a fully kitted Forester full of gear = say aprox 1600kg. You get stuck on a rut going up a 30 degree are bogged to the hieght of tyre depth and you are forced to winch up-hill. Rolling resistance is 1600kg + (1600 x 0.5) = 2,400kg, significantly more than a hand winch is rated for a straight single line pull, thus you will need to know a little bit about multi-line rigging with snatch blocks to move it (or otherwise be very lucky). It's not something that I'd trust a come-along to cope with.


 

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i looked into getting a hand winch, but my dad told me about them braking and killing-dis membering people. Please be careful if you use a hand winch. I chose to use rugs, slabs of wood, and a shovel to get out of the sand. But that stuff only works in sand, mud it will just sink. What about electrical winches? With a remote you can get a safe distance from that line but with the hand winch your right there.. yikes, be safe bro.
 
most good hand winches (not the come along type) come with a 2.5 tonne pulling capacity, a 1.6 lifting capacity. the 11mm steel wire rope supplied has a MBL (mean breaking load) of about 12-15 tonne. inside the winch is whats called sheer pins. this pin will break at about 125% of the rated lifting load. so its about a 1 in a billion chance the rope will snap. BUT that 1 in a billion, is a chance, so what you do is tie a smaller rope in the center (favouring the car side) of the pulling rope and tie it to a log or something heavy so if id does by chance snap this will stop or lessen the recoil. there are special bags you can buy that you fill with sand or something that you can place over the rope. i haven't seen them in action
 
I have a Bushranger. Works a treat. Its max load is 1300kg. I believe all SWL ratings are 2/3 of the max possible (old forklift and dogmen rule I still follow) so I feel I can lift around 1900kg if necessary. My car would never be anything over 1600kg.
It also comes with a national warranty so if it fails I take it to any ARB and apprently they'll hook me no questions. That in itself is encouraging.

Works a treat.
 
Think I've found a formidable hand winch available in the US. I've been hunting around for years and the Tirfor styles are just not available without being incredibly cost prohibitive. Finally a friend of mine sold me his old one which gets very high ratings from a lot of 4x4 folks.

My winch progression...
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Top one I bought after I got my '83 GL, 1ton 'come-along', fortunately I never had to use it, but it was better than nothing.
Middle one I got after I got the Forester, again, just a 'come-along' but upgraded to a 2ton capacity. Neither of the top two had more than 15ft. of cable, and I think both are very limited in what they could have done as far as any kind of recovery work.
The bottom one is a More Power Puller 2ton (they make a 3ton as well) 'dead lift' capacity, and you can equip it with up to 35ft. of cable.:) really wish I had the 3ton since YotaRu is at 5400lbs, but I'm getting to good of a deal to pass up. Once I replace the cable should be good to go. I'll still also carry my bigger come-along, but I'll have much greater peace of mind with the More Power Puller stashed in the back...now hopefully I'll never have to use it.:iconwink:
 
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