Forester turbo question

jlauritsen

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Location
Maryland, USA
So, getting ready to purchase my first car for me, and I have a question about the turbo. For off roading am I understanding this correctly? If you have a turbo, it can increase the chance of spin out when crawling? So overall, for going to slow, a non turbo would be best?

I've had hand me down cars for 15 years, and finally get to pick my car. I never learned much about the mechanics before because... well I never cared enough until now.
 
A turbo on the dirt (offroading) can be your friend, but it can also be your enemy.

The extra torque can be useful for a hill climb for example, but if you get too high with the rev's you can & will stop mid way & start to spin the wheels :evil:
If you're too low with the rev's, you can also stop part way as you'll run out of puff :evil:
You just need to find that sweet spot & most of the time you're fine :raz:

The same can be said for a N/A aswell. You have your pro's & con's with it aswell.
But you do have the advantage of having low range :iconwink:

Hope this has helped & not just confused you further :)

Regards
Mr Turbo
 
Gidday Mr T

Even though I have never driven a turbo Subaru, I can agree with what you are saying, regardless of whether a vehicle has a N/A or turbo engine.

Control of power, power to ground transmission and driver capability are all much more important than sheer power.

Same can be said of other attributes such as gearing etc.

Knowing your car, and your own driving abilities, counts for far more than just sheer grunt, IMNSHO.

My own N/A Fox is not limited by its power/torque, or its gearing.
What makes it such a pleasure to drive both on and off road is also its greatest weakness. It is a modern car-based vehicle, not a military style near-indestructible 4WD ...

No way would it compete off road with a WWII C49 Jeep with its minute and gutless engine. BUT I would never contemplate driving the WWII Jeep on the road these days either!!
 
Well when my 3rd motor goes in my Forester this year all I can say is that I'm dropping in a wrx motor. The N/A's, not including H6 are alright but in comparison to a turbo they are average. Both on and offroad. While in the US you got the EJ25 in all the Foresters and here we got the EJ20 in the SF's (which I have) and to be completely honest it's a pig of an engine. To get it to go anywhere you have to rev the crap out of it, making it not much more economical than an EJ25, which again isn't far off a turbo (depending how you drive it).
But with this said the manuals do have a low range gearbox (not in the US, but everywhere else in the world) so auto is another option. But if you want manual I'd go turbo, I don't see the point in having a fun car but getting it in auto.... kinda defeats the purpose if you ask me. Unless you physically can't drive a manual due to old age (30 plus :lol:.. I'm joking) or disability, etc...

Again this is from my experience, I reckon the EJ25 would have enough power for most applications behind a manual box. I know the EJ25 with an auto can be a bit sluggish as it is only a 4 cylinder.

As Mr Turbo said they have their advantages and disadvantages. While some of us members are pretty hardcore with what we do on here, me included. So I don't think it really matters what I have, I'll thrash it and have fun :iconwink: :cool:

On a note, Subarus aren't rock crawlers. Even while some of us go hard, they just aren't designed for massive amounts of it no matter the amount of modification. While an auto is better for this it makes offroading boring as it is too easy, until lockers are needed.

This is me trying to do some in my non turbo forester with low range. Now it may not look like it but this track was really hardcore, even some of the big 4WD's didn't attempt it :lol: I was glad I got up without even burning the clutch :biggrin: I have seen a Forester GT with manual gearbox get up it though, at the cost of a clutch.

[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vMj9x8LGtB0"]Powerline Hill Climb - Subaru Forester - YouTube[/ame]


Hope this helps
Taza
 
Great vid Taza, nice work.

jlauritsen, the turbo is a great engine. In a little car like a Forester its very fast onroad, it gives you a nice lil push in the back. Offroad, remember Mr.T's comments, you can overpower the wheels plus you dont get low range The EJ25 NA is also a great motor with more than enough torque for most situations offroad, & reasonable performance onroad.

Really, the choice is yours...the XT gives you more hoon potential but a lil trickier offroad.

PS: did you see in Taza's vid how much of a difference an auto makes? He had to juggle clutch, throttle & brake...thats 3 pedals with 2 feet lol :iconwink:
 
Gidday NL

Nachaluva said:
PS: did you see in Taza's vid how much of a difference an auto makes? He had to juggle clutch, throttle & brake...thats 3 pedals with 2 feet lol :iconwink:
Click to expand...

Some of us have 3 feet ...

And 2 heads ...

:poke: :rotfl:

A little more seriously, the SG models introduced EBD to go with the ABS, forming the basis for most of the off-road portion of the VDC that came with the SH models. According to the sales brochure, the SF had ABS brakes, but not EBD.

This greatly reduces the need for heel-and-toeing, which many of us older f@rts learned at our Mother's knee, or some other low joint ;), or from our driving instructor/s, or from an advanced driving course.

EBD works by stopping the free-wheeling of a wheel that has lost traction by selectively applying the brake to that wheel, forcing the opposite wheel on the same axle to apply torque to the ground.

Along with the vLSD in the centre and rear of the SG Foresters, I personally think all these things make for less histrionics and more traction in the field, as it were ... :). Read "less burning clutch smell" ... :cool: :biggrin:
 
jlauritsen the best motor to put in a Forester is a na 2.2 it has heaps of toque.
If you have an auto gearbox a turbo should be ok i am going the auto way now i haven't been on to extreme yet but so far great it's all down to your driving style.
I did notice it doesn't take much to spin wheels when they get a bit light on hard stuff (crossing ruts).
I am not empresses with 2.5 na auto's offroad in harder stuff they do run out of puff.
I have been using a 2.0 na manual offroad duel range and i found it to be great for what it is.
Taza if you put a WRX engine in your car you will break gear boxes doing that sort of work in the video if you want a great setup go 2.2 with a good lsd you'll love it
To sum it up if you want to go slow like in Taza's video manual na for sure
Not as hard auto turbo is great

Jan
 
I like the EJ22 also. Apparently its a bolt in to replace a EJ20, you can even use the EJ20 ECU & harness...but I'd check ALL the details 1st before you commit.
 
If you buy an auto, get the turbo.

Here in aus the manual n/a comes with a dual range gearbox so the choice is not so simple.

If the turbo and n/a both come with the same gearbox, I see no reason to buy the n/a.

If you really want to rock crawl, buy a jeep.
 
Okay, so I have to throw one into the mix. My wife and I are talking about getting a small travel trailer. (maybe a Scamp) in either case it would come under the towing max, so I know about the weights, but as far as turbo goes with the towing, I get the more power.

Any advice as to towing with or without turbo?
 
^ The turbo would be best for towing but be aware that while power wouldn't be an issue, fuel economy could easily be worse than 15mpg... If for example your sitting on 80mph or going up hill or into head on winds.
The only thing is if you get an automatic turbo and you live in a hot climate it could have overheating issues.

The 2.5l N/A would tow quite fine too unless there are hills. I know I've used an outback to tow a 2 tonne trailer (my forester was on the trailer) and I was extremely surprised how well it towed it. Could of easily gotten upto 60mph if needed ( I didn't of course).
 
Well, no matter what I use for towing, I know I won't get good gas milage. Almost anything that can tow decently, drops mpg when you add 2000lbs behind the car.
 
Last edited:
taza said:
^ The turbo would be best for towing but be aware that while power wouldn't be an issue, fuel economy could easily be worse than 15mpg... If for example your sitting on 80mph or going up hill or into head on winds.
Click to expand...
When I towed my camper trailer across the Nullarbor to Shark Bay in Sept 2009 I found the strong head winds increased the consumption of my 07 XT to 14.1L/100km (16.7 mpg US) between Nullarbor Roadhouse and Mundrabilla. On the return trip, still with even stronger winds but behind me, I recorded a 9.9L/100km (23.8 mpg US). I did 13,000km that month with the trailer and averaged 11.8L/100km (20 mpg US).

The following year when I was in the Kimberleys I met a couple towing a camper trailer similar to mine with an 04 Forester X manual and they were getting worse consumption than I was with my XT manual. We put that down to the X having to work much harder with the extra load of the trailer.
 
^ I do agree there, my 2.0l especially with any load (5 people in the car) would get worse economy than pretty much any larger motor as you have to work it so hard just to go anywhere.. :(
 
My 2.5na manual Outback tows my small camper trailer fine.
In my experience the key is to travel at slower speeds than you would expect to when 'bob tailed'.
For hilly stuff I have the advantage of the dual range transmission as well. :)
 
Gidday JL

Regardless of what may be said, I towed my 7x4 foot box trailer, empty and packed chockers, up and down steep hills, behind my 1.8L N/A 1993 Impreza 5 door 5MT hatch, around town with a ton of sand in it, on the open road at speeds up to around 130 km/h (I am more law-abiding these days ... :iconwink:) over a period of 18 years.

Before that, I moved myself from Adelaide to Melbourne towing this trailer behind a 1981 1.6L Mitsubishi Colt. Six or seven trips here and back. It was fine.

Other than having to actually use the gears (that's what they're there for, folks ... ), I have never had a problem.

I still have that trailer, and it weighs in around 150 kgs more now than it did when I bought it in 1981. It was substantially rebuilt earlier this year - see thread here.

I haven't towed it very far at all since then (haven't registered it yet ... ), but I can assure you that the 2.5L N/A Forester does not have a problem towing it!! Don't even know it's there ...

If I were trying to drag it up a 30° dirt slope when full, that would probably change. However, I suspect that power-to-ground transmission would kill that endeavour off long before the Fox ran out of grunt ...

Just IMHO, of course.
 
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