HELP! What have I done?

Rambler

Forum Member
Joined
May 13, 2017
Messages
47
Location
Castlemaine, VIC
Car Year
2006
Car Model
Forester X
Transmission
5MT
Firstly my car is an '06 SG Forester with a 5MT.
Today I decided to change the transmission oil, engine oil and do an upper engine clean as my car is approaching 200,000kms.

I did the transmission oil first - T70 torx, let all the old oil drain, cleaned the drain plug, fitted a new washer and torqued to 44nm, before refilling with 80W-90 Castrol fully synthetic gear oil. Filled to roughly 3.5L on the bottle, checked dipstick and added a little more - I'd say all up maybe 3.75L went in. Got in the car and the gears felt smooth.

Anyway I went on to do the upper engine clean - About 15 minutes in BAM the car stalls horribly at around 3,000 revs. Trying to re start it just makes the car lurch forward - it's still in neutral.

If I hold the clutch in I can start it, but if I put it in first and come off the clutch slowly I can see the revs dip but the car does not want to move forward. My thought is that I have overfilled my transmission, I'm waiting for it to cool now so that I can try to remove about 250ml.

Have I broken my transmission?
 
Gear stick will also not go into any gear except first and reverse and there is no neutral, the car acts as if it is in first. Dip stick just says oil level is perfect on H but I wonder if it doesn't register overfilled, only underfilled.

Why would they make it fail so dramatically just from a bit too much oil? I can't find anyone else on the net that this has happened to? :cry:
 
Sounds very weird to me ...

I suspect that your gearbox oil change and the breakdown are only coincidentally related.
 
definitely weird. How did it lock up while idling/doing your UEC out of gear?

No - its not the oil. Too full or empty won't do this.

yes - sounds like the gearbox has jammed up - maybe you dislodged a floating chunk of something that was nestled in the bottom of the box. Do you know the entire history of this gearbox from new?

Going on the assumption that what you did is somehow related to the failure -- have you checked the dipstick again? Did it somehow drop into the 'box?

Drain the box again and see if anything hard and shiny comes out.
 
Maybe fresh oil has caused it to do whatever it was wanting to do.

It was feeling a little bit stiff and occasionally difficult to get into second on some cold mornings, it didn't feel particularly unhealthy however (no noises) and there wasn't much more than a decent film of metal sludge on the plug magnet. Oil was old.

I just drained about 300mls of oil, dip stick is now measuring in between H and L on the low side, so I was probably about right with 250mls. Still nothing, now wont go into any gears.


Gee this is pretty bad if I can't get it going. With 200,000ks and a leaking steering rack, plus on the original clutch, I'm thinking I'd be up for more than it's worth in repairs.
 
It locked up while I was revving to burn off the last of the UEC, I was standing outside of the car with my foot on the accelerator so nowhere near the gearstick or clutch, car was in neutral and then it was like the clutch dropped, it died very quickly with a bit of a noise. I thought I must have hydrolocked the engine at first, but it started fine with clutch in.
 
As for history of gear box/car - Clutch has never been done, rear diff oil was done at 140k but probably not transmission. So could be original oil.

I'll drain it again and see what happens.
 
https://www.subaruforester.org/vbulletin/f89/transmission-has-seized-advice-531865/

I've found another thread detailing a nearly identical thing happening to the same 06-08 model Forester, revved high in neutral when it suddenly suddenly stalls without lurching. Replies there are confused as well but it does seem that my transmission has grenaded itself. Calling a mechanic for a qualified opinion tomorrow. What a bummer.
 
https://www.subaruforester.org/vbulletin/f89/transmission-has-seized-advice-531865/

I've found another thread detailing a nearly identical thing happening to the same 06-08 model Forester, revved high in neutral when it suddenly suddenly stalls without lurching. Replies there are confused as well but it does seem that my transmission has grenaded itself. Calling a mechanic for a qualified opinion tomorrow. What a bummer.

wow - bizarre. I'm with the 'WAG' guy - it sounds like some failure on the clutch assembly which has caused it to jam - failure of the clutch plate or loose bolts maybe.

If the clutch suddenly failed - I wouldn't be surprised if that killed the input shaft primary gearset (or whatever its called) which maybe explains his bits of metal in the trans.. maybe that secondary failure didn't happen to you if you're lucky (though not being able to get into gear isn't a good sign).

Is there still a flywheel inspection port on your model? Big rubber bung at the bottom of the bell housing, or maybe no bung? Try pulling that out and see if any bits fall out, or inspect your garage floor..
 
You did an upper engine clean, right ? With high pressure water and soak ? Think it could come from there...
 
wow - bizarre. I'm with the 'WAG' guy - it sounds like some failure on the clutch assembly which has caused it to jam - failure of the clutch plate or loose bolts maybe.

If the clutch suddenly failed - I wouldn't be surprised if that killed the input shaft primary gearset (or whatever its called) which maybe explains his bits of metal in the trans.. maybe that secondary failure didn't happen to you if you're lucky (though not being able to get into gear isn't a good sign).

Is there still a flywheel inspection port on your model? Big rubber bung at the bottom of the bell housing, or maybe no bung? Try pulling that out and see if any bits fall out, or inspect your garage floor..

Scratch that theory.

It failed while out of gear, clutch out. Clutch still works.

Something has failed on the input shaft or thereabouts
 
You did an upper engine clean, right ? With high pressure water and soak ? Think it could come from there...

Upper engine clean in a can, no water necessary - It's a recommended service procedure every few oil changes. Like Seafoam products. Can is sprayed into the intake with engine running, burns off carbon build up inside manifold and cylinder. I was following can procedure and 'burning off' the product at the end i.e. holding revs at 3000k with car in neutral when it went pop.

Just got a quote for reco'd transaxle, new clutch and steering rack from Subabits in Melbourne, it was less than I was preparing for. The car might be off the road for a while but I'll probably just have the work done.
 
For those playing at home - Quoted $1980 AUD for reco'd gearbox, $720 for clutch but possibly more if its dual mass (base model X so doubt it but wouldn't know), $395 for steering rack, prices are supplied and fitted inc. a new rear main seal too. Wish I could spend that money on a lift kit and suspension...
 
Aaaarrrgghhhh ... :cry:

Very sad news, Rambler!

Check the head gaskets while it is all in bits ...
 
After sleeping on it I'm starting to think that it might not be wise to repair.

Payed $6,500 for the car 4 months ago, assuming that is still the repaired value.

Repair quote was $3,000, but apparently more with a dual mass flywheel. I can't find much info but my car probably does have a dual mass flywheel. If I can find out for sure and then how much more it might be the decider.

Car has other small issues besides the failure and steering rack but any cheap car is going to have small running repairs or on the horizon. Biggest one is that the tyres are 5 years old and probably have only a year left in them.

I was prepared for a big 4k job to do the head gaskets and the clutch at some point in the remaining life of the car. At least I would have the clutch done with this repair. But my big concern is the prospect of having to do the head gasket at some point, and probably other stuff like belts as they're 60k old now... If I had to do that within a few years now I'd have spent a fair bit more than the car value. So important to work out if that's even likely.

As it sits in my driveway it's maybe worth a grand. If I were to add that to the 3,500 it would cost me in repairs anyway, I could probably get a decent Mitsubishi Challenger with similar KMs. As I'm now on my third Subaru in 6 months, two of which have died within weeks of buying them, I'm not really feeling a lot of joy for this one or another one.

On the other hand fixing the car would leave me with a car worth 6,500 again, so 2 grand in gained value over selling and getting a Challenger. But that doesn't matter because I was hoping to drive whatever I own for the rest of its life; if the Challenger is trouble free for 100,000 but the Subie needs head gaskets before then, it's 2 grand gained the other way. Both have similar fuel costs, Subaru is safer and has better road manners. But Challenger is a more capable 4WD, and I was planning to do a lot of mods that I might not need to do to a Challenger.

Obviously the prospect of something new is more exciting than dumping a bunch of money just to get back exactly the same car I had 2 days ago. Maybe I've also lost a bit of faith in Subies. But I'm trying to stay level headed. Any decision is a few weeks off anyway. For now I bought a cheap car cover on eBay because I'd rather not look at it :p
 
My suggestion would be to try someone else to do your pre purchase inspections because it would seem from your history whoever has been doing it in the past is not very good. Either that or you ignored their advice. A good service history is vital for any car you buy second hand. One can only speculate as to what the failure is until a proper inspection is done. The dual mass flywheel is prone to fail and I replaced mine when it failed with a standard flywheel.
 
It sounds like you needed to go for a drive after changing the oil in the box. This would've ensured that the oil was in all the nooks and crannies in the gearbox.

To me it sounds like a bearing was dry, most likely in the selector rings that are connected to the selector rods.

It's still very odd and I'd be keen to pull the box down to have a look at it and get to the bottom of what went wrong.

Shame to hear you've had so many issues with subarus. That's not been my experience with them. I've still got my first Subaru as has my mother inlaw. My sister has had three with the current one her first she's actually owned :p

If your car does long country runs I wouldn't bother with the UEC treatment. I did it to my ej22 with very little results/gains.

SGs are pretty thin in the yards but you can find parts online cheaper than going through a mechanic - but if you're not mechanically minded or have mates that are (and willing to help out) the mechanic route would be best for ease and piece of mind.

Very sorry to hear about the gearbox and your situation. I hope it all works out for you in the end.

Cheers

Bennie
 
Sorry to hear. The price you have quoted for the head gaskets and clutch is way over the top. Might be worth talking to John Bailey at Volks-Baru.
 
I'm getting a feeling might be the input shaft. The bearing tends to wear out & like Bennie said, may have run dry causing a failure. Which would explain both the jamming & loss of drive if the shaft has moved out of position

Also speak to these guys for an extra opinion/quote:

[FONT=&quot]Volks-Baru - John[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Ph: 03 97935655[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]1362 Heatherton Rd, Dandenong North, Vic. 3175[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Lucas Automotive - Lucas[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
Phone: 03 9553 3995[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]92 Levanswell Rd, Moorabbin VIC 3189, Australia[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]
Kingston Garage (Bosch Service Centre) - Ross Hallett
Ph: 03 9551-2402
63 Kingston Rd, Heatherton[/FONT]
 
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