Clutch trouble

My clutch gave out after 187,000k a little while back. Replaced the clutch, then it started slipping again after a few hundred k. Adjusted it, same thing again. Replaced the clutch again (no charge, under warranty), same problem.

Gary (mechanic) long since checked pressures in the master and slave cylinders, which were normal, but the problem keeps coming back. You drive normally for a few hundred k, then you do a longish trip (50k or so) on the highway and the slips are back. Once they come back, it slips all the time from then on, even when cold.

Gary figures that, even though it checks out fine, it must be the master cylinder and he's going to replace it next week. Anyone else had a similar problem?

Gidday Tannin

If any moisture has got into your clutch fluid, either the master or slave cylinders could be jamming in the depressed position - i.e. failing to return properly - thereby causing slippage.

Is there less resistance from the clutch pedal when depressing when it is in slipping mode?

Thanks Ratbag. Once it starts slipping, that's it. It keeps on doing it. Possibly there is a little less resistance now that you mention it. The main thing - which I didn't notice but Gary did straight away - is that once it starts slipping the pedal has no slack - i.e., it starts disengaging fully at the top of its travel rather than moving a few cm before anything happens. I have no idea when the fluid was changed last - whenever the garage which has serviced it since new thinks it's a good idea, I guess.

Forgive my ignorance, would replacing a clutch require changing the fluid? (Just curiosity there - obviously, replacing the master cylinder will involve fluid replacement so it doesn't matter at this point.)

BTW (and completely off-topic), I have a friend who drives an ancient Datsun 120Y. (No-one knows why he drives it, he just likes it, apparently.) He lives up country and does a heap of k. One day he got me to give him a lift because the Datsun was at the garage having a new master cylinder installed. "How long does a master cylinder last in one of those?" I asked, just to pass the time of day. "One million, one hundred and four thousand, three hundred and six kilometres" he replied!

Tannin said:

Thanks Ratbag. Once it starts slipping, that's it. It keeps on doing it. Possibly there is a little less resistance now that you mention it. The main thing - which I didn't notice but Gary did straight away - is that once it starts slipping the pedal has no slack - i.e., it starts disengaging fully at the top of its travel rather than moving a few cm before anything happens. I have no idea when the fluid was changed last - whenever the garage which has serviced it since new thinks it's a good idea, I guess.

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That sounds more like a dead slave cylinder, but probably both should be done. I used to have mine bored out and a brass sleeve pressed in. They never gave trouble after that ...

Forgive my ignorance, would replacing a clutch require changing the fluid? (Just curiosity there - obviously, replacing the master cylinder will involve fluid replacement so it doesn't matter at this point.)

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Not usually necessary, but should have been done anyway ...

BTW (and completely off-topic), I have a friend who drives an ancient Datsun 120Y. (No-one knows why he drives it, he just likes it, apparently.) He lives up country and does a heap of k. One day he got me to give him a lift because the Datsun was at the garage having a new master cylinder installed. "How long does a master cylinder last in one of those?" I asked, just to pass the time of day. "One million, one hundred and four thousand, three hundred and six kilometres" he replied!

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Yeah. Flaming near indestructible, and as dangerous as hell ...

Ratbag said:

Yeah. Flaming near indestructible, and as dangerous as hell ...

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Tell me about it! Years ago when I was young and stupid, I had a Mazda rotary rocketship. My daily commute to university went up a long, straight backroad, fairly narrow and not a great surface - no horrorshow, just a bit old and uneven - and I habitually sat on 100 for that stretch. (That's miles in my car back them, not k.)

I shared a house with the daughter of a car dealer from a small country town. She never had her own car; her dad just used to lend her whichever of the trade-ins was going spare for a few months at a time, then swap them over. One time the Mazda was getting serviced or something so my housemate lent me her car. Well, her dad's car actually - a 120Y. What a crate! The shockers were .... well, more to the point, they weren't. Might as well not have had any. (As if 120Ys aren't bad enough factory-fresh.) So I drove it to uni, on the same road I regularly cruised up at 100 MPH. I wound the 120Y up to 80k (the speedo on it was in k not miles) and I was fair-dinkim terrified! It was all over the road like a drunken sailor! I very soon backed off to 60k on this 100k limit road that I usually took at 160k.

I have never forgotten being scared out of my brain by a car at 80k on a half-decent straight bitumen road with no traffic! As for her father, to this day I don't understand how he could sleep at nights knowing his only daughter was driving that death trap.

Before changing the master and slave cylinder, you should put some silicone spray in the master cylinder while pushing the pedal and in the slave cylinder without pushing the pedal and then make a few press and releases, it should help a lot if the problem comes from there. It happens when the rubber seal is too dry and usually when the car is hot.

Trouble turned out to be the clutch itself. The part was suppled by Clutch Industries. It was a dud. It was then replaced with another new one, also from Clutch Industries, and also a complete dud that only worked for a couple of hundred kilometres. Another Forester owner had the same problem with the same brand of clutch.

The Clutch Industries crap part also had to be replacd with a part of a diferent brand, which has worked perfectly OK.

which bit was faulty? Pressure plate?

I think that would be right mate.

Glad to hear that you have FINALLY got this fixed, mate.

Tannin said:

My clutch gave out after 187,000k

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Woops. That should have read 287,000k

Cheers Rats. Meanwhile, I'm still battling. Bad shudder under power. Replaced a front driveshaft last week, but the shudder came straight back. Maybe we need to do the other one as well. It is definately related to being under power: lift your foor a bit and it eases or goes away. Speed doesn't make much difference, put your foot down at 80k on the highway in 5th or at 25k up a steepish hill it's more or less the same. Lift off and it's OK.

I'm actually tossing up three options:

(1) Just keep buggerising about till the old girl works the way she used to.

(2) Buy a low-mileage MY07 or MY08 Forester essentially the same as my MY05 but not so tired ('cause I really really like the old model).

(3) Buy a new one. Maybe I should start a fresh thread for that though.

Could be the main shaft, think Dedman had a similar problem.